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I arranged for my daughter and her 12 month old baby to visit me in San Antonio, TX. Having never ridden a train, I booked them both seats round trip from Fort Worth, and she was excited. When arriving at the station, all were told that the train was, at present, over 6 hours late, and they were put on a n 8 hour non-stop bus trip to SA. With a baby in her lap for 8 solid hours, NO STOPS, no milk offered for the baby, and a boxed sandwich offered enroute, she could not even get up to go to the bathroom. By the time she reached me she was hysterical and traumatized. Spoke to Amtrak and, until I got to 'customer relations'(I know why they don't call it suctomer service) everyone was kind. If I chose to try again, they offered an upgrade on the return trip, and contingient on my right to cancel, I accepted. 14 hours before departure, Amtrak called me to inform me that the train for that day was cancelled. They said I would be refunded, now they've changed their tune. I spent $187 to fly my daughter home, and although she never set foot on a train, through no fault of our own, Amtrak is refusing a refund, saying my tickets were non-refundable. Of course I hadn't been told that, I was simply given and fare and paid it. I will fervently advise anyone I can NEVER to do business with Amtrak. Furthermore, these people are subsidized. How much unwarranted money must they have kept from refunding just that weekend alone? And my tax money is subsidizing this ripoff?
Posts: 3 | From: San Antonio, Texas USA | Registered: Aug 2001
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I greatly sympathize with your terrible experience on the Texas Eagle. I had a similar problem with Amtrak last December on my way to Tucson from Chicago. We were 12 1/2 hours late into Dallas Texas (2:00 am), and we were told that they would not run the train any farther and we would have to take a bus to El Paso!! That is a 900 mile trip taking from 10 to 12 hours. When I declined their offer to take the bus I demanded compensation for my expenses and inconvenience, and when they refused I took Amtrak to Small Claims Court where I was awarded about $1400. They have still refused to pay, and I am now in the process of enforcing my judgment (including if necessary seizing one of their trains). Amtrak has been very difficult to deal with ever since they started their promises of "Satisfaction Guaranteed." About five years ago I had a similar problem with their attempting to bus me, and I was completely reimbursed all my expenses. I think Amtrak should drop the so-called guarantees and go back to the old way of satisfying their "guests." However, come this Christmas I will give them another chance since more often than not I have had good experiences with Amtrak.
Posts: 524 | From: Toronto Ont. Canada | Registered: Mar 2001
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I understand your problems. Amtrak customer relations is terrible. Their "Satisfaction Guarantee" is a farce. Amtrak should in no way substitute a bus for a train.
Your comments about Amtrak being subsidized are unfair. It is true that Amtrak is subsidized, but they are subsidized less than the airline industry, and far less than automobiles are. Others may check me if I am wrong, but I believe that out of all long-distance land transportation systems (including airlines, but excluding ships), the government spends the least on Amtrak per passenger mile.
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Konstantin, I believe you are correct about the subsidy info. Other modes of transportation are subsidized in one way or another. But I do think that Amtrak should use bus substitutes if that is a 'reasonable' choice. Granted a bus is usually less appealing than a train, but I do think Amtrak should honor its transportation commitments. If a bus is the best available alternative, so be it.
Posts: 874 | From: South Bay (LA County), Calif, USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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quote:Originally posted by MPALMER: But I do think that Amtrak should use bus substitutes if that is a 'reasonable' choice. Granted a bus is usually less appealing than a train, but I do think Amtrak should honor its transportation commitments. If a bus is the best available alternative, so be it.
I agree. I would hate to be stuck in an unfamiliar part of nowhere facing an annulled train. Sometimes it's impossible for a train to continue - tracks blocked, mechanical problems, or a train so far off-schedule that to continue would affect connections to other trains or even the next day's departure. I'm guessing, but something along those lines probably happened in royaltrains's case (El Paso requires a connection to the Sunset, and if the Eagle had continued to San Antonio it would have delayed the Sunset twelve hours - then you have twice as many unhappy passengers. Using a shortcut, a bus from Dallas-El Paso allows connecting passengers to "catch up" to a on-time Sunset. Not a good solution, but a bus is the best alternative).
deb2K, Rest assured your previous trip had problems which were highly unusual. If you ever try Amtrak again, I think you will have a pleasant, enjoyable trip. I sympathize with your terrible experience, but in Amtrak's defense they did offer alternate (if substandard) transportation when a train was not available (which often isn't directly Amtrak's fault). Airlines have their problems too - how many television reports did you see last winter about passengers stranded in airports (sometimes for a day or more) from cancelled flights (due to weather)? If they offered alternate transportation (like a train!), I never heard about it.
That said, if I were you I too would be highly upset. I don't know what "discount ticket" you had that would not be eligible for a refund, but you should have been given credit certainly (and a voucher to be used against future Amtrak travel, since they most certainly did not meet your "satisfaction").
[This message has been edited by DC2001 (edited 08-09-2001).]
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Maybe Amtrak could offer a choice of going on a bus or not.
I don't think many people take a train just to get from one place to another. It is much more efficient to drive or fly. When I just want to get from point A to point B, I drive. I take a train to go everywhere in between. When I pay for a train ride, I expect a train, not a bus.
------------------ Elias Valley Railroad (N-scale) www.geocities.com/evrr
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Thank you to all who have replied in an understanding manner. I can tell you what happened from the seat, with my daughter in my lap, no milk, limited food (perpared and given in bad taste), and no ability to releave myself for eight hours. It greatly resembled the original sentence you have just read. Unbearbly long and hard to endure. No matter how "reasonable" some of you feel the bus charter was, I am extrememly inclined to disagree. All I could think of when I arrived at the train station was the scenery from the lounge car, or the dinner we might get in the dining car. I was excited about the prospect of being able to move around and let my daughter play. When all was said and done, I had been so mistreated, considering my need of assistance, that I was in tears when my mother arrived. I unloaded my own luggage and car seat with my daughter in my arms. THe attendant at the final destination looked at me when I requested the time while standing outside, (unable to carry everything inside for lack of arm room) and he said that I could go inside and look at the clock on the wall. He then chose to ignore my request for help by smileing and walking off. I starved so that my daughter had enough to eat on the ride and only drank water, and I ignored the cramping of my bladder as it cried in agony because there was no way to secure my daughter in a seat on the bus (although it had been paid for). There were ways that they could have been more reasonable such as, chartering a tour Bus that provides more seating room instead of a trashy greyhound, or stopping at a resteraunt so that we might eat a sensible meal and stretch. Amtrak did not do the best they could, nad there werew many other people who agreed, such as the family of five who had gone from San Antonio into Austin that Morning for a day trip and were not told when they got the tickets for a sleeper car return that they would be returning on a bus. Amtrak new of the problem four days before that day, of the inconvenience. For those of you who have rationalized the incident and decided that Amtrak acted OK, maybe you have never had to endure that kind of trip, or maybe you do not understand the stress derived from not being able to secure your child in a car seat in a moving automobile. What-ever the reason, I hope you have at least attempted to understand it from my point of view. For humor's sake I will tell you that they even misspelled my name on the "Service Guarantee Certificate" Posts: 3 | From: Fort Worth, Tx. USA | Registered: Aug 2001
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To clarify my situation in Dallas last year: There was no emergency, the train was just running very late (over 12 hours). Amtrak obviously did not want to pay overtime to their crew or delay the Sunset in San Antonio,instead they did not hesitate to inconvenience the fare-paying passengers. In my case I paid for a deluxe bedroom and was thrown off the train at 2:00 am. "Just take this delightful 12 hour bus ride to El Paso" I was told. Who in their right mind would agree to ride a disgusting bus over that period of time after paying for a deluxe bedroom? I really think that Deb2K should take Amtrak to court as I did. Her situation with her child was particularly outrageous, far worse then mine, and I think she would obtain a sympathetic hearing from a judge. If Deb2K lives in Texas, I do believe they have small claims courts in that state, and the costs of going to this court are quite reasonable. Sue them, they deserve it.
Posts: 524 | From: Toronto Ont. Canada | Registered: Mar 2001
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Deb2K, DebKDaughter, and others: I agree the bus journey should have included a reasonable break for lunch...at least 30 minutes. The lack of honesty about timeliness & availability of equipment has happened to me also, but never in such a nightmarish situation.
Should you choose to ride the train again, I recommend that you call the toll-free number to get a "status" of the train before it gets to your station. The message tells how late the train is running, and it has always been pretty accurate whenever I had tried it, but you do need to know the train number and other station(s) on the line you are traveling.
I generally do not rely on the comments from station agents re: train delays. I get the impression that the station employees are not kept up to date on train status.
In response to an earlier post...the train is sometimes a substitute for airlines! Once on a trip back east, some flights were cancelled due to fog, so some travelers chose to take the train. This was in the high-traffic Northeast Corridor (Wash DC - Philadelphia - Newark) so that was a practical alternative in that case.
Posts: 874 | From: South Bay (LA County), Calif, USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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How would you suggest Amtrak handle the problem? Would you wait for 6 or more hours to board at Ft Worth? Would you have Amtrak keep spare trains at every station?
hmmmm.give advanced notice since they new four days ahead of time...hhhhmmmmm chater a much more similiar or more apropriate transport and provide a more appropriet lunch
Do you have children, or maybe a heart? Would you want your wife and young child to be stuck in a similair situation.
If you don't have any thing else, and refuse to attempt an understanding....hmmmm I know a nice cold place where you can maybe get an idea of your attitude. I get the distinct impression that you work for Amtrak. I am now recalling why buraucracy leaves such a bad taste in my mouth, and I'm sure that the other passsangers would agree. Would your care to explain to my daughter why she had such a limited amount of milk, and why she couldn't play? Good Day.
Posts: 3 | From: Fort Worth, Tx. USA | Registered: Aug 2001
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Yes I have a wife and daughter, yes we have traveled Amtrak over the years, yes we have been inconvenienced sometimes, no I do not (and never have) work for Amtrak.
My experience do not include any bus trips with my daughter that were that long, but Montreal to Albany and Baltimore to Harrisburg. On the Harrisburg trip my daughter was about 2. She didn't like it and showed it. I know exactly what you mean about trying to explain.
They have on these and other occassions when I have been bussed made meal stops and often "rest" stops too. It may be the bus companies option, if so surely Amtrak could issue some kind of instruction when they order the bus.
If they knew 4 days in advance why didn't they tell you, it has been my experience that they do. They sure should - thats why they ask for a contact number when you make the reservation (I thought).
So yes, I know what you are saying about it being a problem, but I believe that Amtrak had only a limited number of options available.
What conveyance is equivalent for instance. And where is the nearest one that is available.
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I appreciate ALL the input, not just some of it. That is why I posted the topic. The experience can not be relived, it is done. Today, I am just unhappy with the response I received in trying to deal with Amtrak. My credit company is disputing the charges, and my daughter has been issued a voucher for half the fare. Amtrak did not offer an alternative for return transportation, and even by their word, they reserve the option to offer alternative transportation. That did not happen. I am not a well off person, just a working person. The price I paid to get her home hurt my pocketbook considerably and at the very least, Customer Relation should have made a better effort. I presented my problem to them calmly, considerately and clearly. I waited 2 days to call them so that my anger would not do the talking. They were, in turn, just rude, uncompromising and argumentative. The fact that they advertise customer satisfaction yet were so clearly not even slightly interesting in same still makes me mad. If I don't speak out, there is no chance that the bar will be raised. Please continue with your input, much of it very informative, all of it apppreciated. We don't have to agree, but we do have to speak. Thanks
Posts: 3 | From: San Antonio, Texas USA | Registered: Aug 2001
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Pelican,Your new response is considerably more tolerable and with the new information I now feel that you do have a fraction of the understanding. What Amtrak provided was not their prime example of service, and I am aware of that. I feel that they made poor decisions reguarding this incident and with my understanding of business, I feel that their need to shut down some of the last passenger trai lines in the country are partially contigent on poor judgement on behalf of customer service. I hope that soemday I may feel comfortable enough to try making the journey again. I would sttil greatly enjoy the opportunity to experiance such an increasingly rare journey. I am not planning on the train for my trip to Portland as I had originally hoped though. I agree with my mother's previous statement of gratitude towards all who have posted. Have a good day to all.
Posts: 3 | From: Fort Worth, Tx. USA | Registered: Aug 2001
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In the recent merger mainia among freight roads, the govenment's main concern has been to "preserve competition". After all, competition is the magic elixir that keeps costs down and makes customer service warm and fuzzy!
There is an amusing commercial on the radio for telephone service. It has someone ordering a meal at a fast food place. The charge comes to something like $645.85! the announcer then asks, "what would it be like if there were only one fast food chain?"
I will be among the first to buy a ticket on "USRail" Especially if they promise "6-inch thick mattresses" in their sleeping cars!
Posts: 75 | From: Somerville, NJ USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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