Just before pulling into Alpine Texas, the conductor annouced that a derailment near El Paso had caused major track damage, and we'd be bussed from Alpine to El Paso. The buses were to arrive at 1:30 PM, but didn't pull in until 8 that night (no explanation from Amtrak staff). And, we rode to Tucson, not El Paso, and got to Ontario California 8+ hours late.

That was a couple of months ago, but it appears things haven't improved a lot. I checked the Website yesterday, and it showed the SL getting into LA 8 hours late. I've also seen that it's got the worst on-time record (0.0%) of any Amtrak train.

I love riding trains, I support Amtrak, and I'm willing to endure a few inconveniences. If I get somewhere a couple of hours late, I can deal with that. But to me, 8 hours late is beyond the pale, even for a leisure traveler.

In my opinion, Amtrak needs to decide what it wants to do with the SL. Either work with UP to fix the glitches and delays, go to daily service (so people don't have to plan their trip around a thrice-weekly schedule), or drop the route altogether.

I digress, however. I think that UP is very uncomfortable with Amtrak, because the Sunset puts a certain RR's operational deficiencies on public display - with Amtrak and the passengers as its victims. I mean, come on, did anyone see the O-T-P posted for April? The sunset had 0 %. Not once did that train arrive on time. Amtrak reps are rumored to have a meeting with the UP brass sometime this month (note that I wrote that this was a rumor). Perhas what is needed is for something like what happened years ago, where there were Congressional hearings about how the passenger trains were handled over the Sunset Route. Passengers (even train enthusiasts like myself) have an expectation that they will arrive at there destination within a reasonable amount of time - not 12 - 14 hours late (like what happened to the Sunset a couple of days ago).

Chucktxa, you have my condolensces. If I were in the same situation, I, too would feel much the same, if not more displeased. While I would not go so far as to recommend the dissolution of Amtrak based upon one single experience, perhaps the time has come to take the Sunset off of UP rails, and put it as much as possible on to BNSF. Perhaps another solution would be to discontinue the Sunset E of NOL, and replace that portion with the another train, like what was done in the late 1980s or early 1990s.

PS: As of April 30, the Sunset arrived into LA over 16 hours late. It got interference from CSX E of NOL, and never rcovered the time. Of course, once it got on to UP rails, there was no hoipe whatsoever. This is inexcusable. UP needs to spend some of its next capital improvement budget on getting the Sunset route double tracked. Very dissappointing. It makes me wonder if UP gets anything anywhere on time.

On the plus side, most onboard personnel I've encountered (not only on the Sunset but the Eagle as well) do a hell of a job under some very trying circumstances, not only with delays, but with equipment that's starting to show its age.

First, the conditions encountered by Mr. chuck during his reported 1969 Sunset trip were probably the catylist that brought about ICC ex-parte 287, which, in pertinent part, imposed standards of service upon the SP's Sunset.

However, once imposed, and also reducing the train to its never changed present day tri-weekly frequency, I sincerely believe the SP lived up to the promulgated standards of service.

Based upon a Dec 1970 NO-El Paso ride, I found first that the SP was willing to hold for a late L&N Pan American (transfer was made at the former Carrolton Ave station). By Houston, #1 was one hour late. However, next day, with deft train dispatching that literally "cleared the railroad", El Paso arrival was comofrtably on time.

As for on board, Sleeping car service had been restored, including the NY-LA through car. Full dining service offering SP's excellent cuisine was there (so was the Automat for those who cared to partake of such) and equipment was immaculately clean.

I have had few problems with SP service and, as I have noted at a posting at another board, I believe their passenger service got a "bum rap".

Meanwhile, back to present day reality--

I've booked the family on the Sunset Limited from Orlando to New Orleans and the the City of New Orleans from NO up to Illinois in early June.

Amtrak On-Time Performance for March 2004

Amtrak On-Time Performance Trends and Hours of Delay by Cause

Since the percentage of late trains doesn't tell you how late the trains actually are, this really doesn't tell you what you want to know, your best bet is to follow the status of the trains your going to take using the Amtrak website over a period of time.

I almost got it in July 2002 going from Los Angeles to Ft. Worth in the 422 sleeper.

However, there was a UP derailment east of El Paso (same song...different year...) and #2 was annulled in El Paso. No charter buses had been located by the time we arrived in El Paso even though rumors had been spreading among passengers about the derailment since leaving Tucson hours earlier. We were invited to "use the train as a hotel" until buses could be rounded up.
(Through Sunset passengers wound up on the motionless train all night......those connecting to the Texas Eagle were placed on buses after 'only' 6 or 7 hours waiting in El Paso.)

Not wanting to spend 600 miles riding overnight on a packed bus, I managed to catch a cab to the airport (with 4 other Amtrak expatriots) and flew Southwest Airlines to Dallas that night. Of course as a walk-up pasenger flying one way I managed to be 'randomly' selected for additional security screening.

I'm not sure if there is a solution for the Sunset Limited. Nothing has ever really seemed to do the job going back 33 years now.

quote:

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Originally posted by SilverStar092:
The Sunset never ran separately east of New Orleans since it was extended to Florida 10 years ago except when operating conditions dictated a stub train or once in awhile when #2 was so late that a stub train was run NOL-Miami or Orlando. In the pre-Amtrak days the SCL ran the Gulf Wind between NOL and JAX. We then suffered aver 20 years with no passenger service through North Florida. Amtrak needs to run a daily train between NOL and Miami (or one that reliably connects at JAX) using equipment from the City of New Orleans that lays over in NOL for 22 hours. Then when the Sunset is terribly late, its passengers can stay overnight at NOL and connect to Florida a day later.

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I agree that it would be really nice if NOL-ORL or MIA service were operated as a separate train. If this 'new' Gulf Wind were only offered tri-weekly schedules could at least be adjusted a bit to increase the layover time in New Orleans........like schedule #2 in three or four hours earlier and the 'new' Gulf Wind out two or three hours later.....something like that would reduce the number of misconnects.

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David Pressley

I assume, like BNSF, that UP receives incentive payments for running Amtrak on time. Those incentives are worth millions to BNSF every year, so I was told at their Network Ops Center near Fort Worth. So they aim to run the trains on time (and they often do). Now, either UP don't care, or the incentive payments are so insignificant as to be worthless to a company with a multi-million (billion?) dollar turnover. Does anybody know for sure?

In any case, remember the old adage. A late train just gets later.

Geoff M.

A restored NOL-Florida Gulf Wind would not be able to leave New Orleans any later than #2 is currently scheduled as 10:30pm is late enough.

The sad thing is that for the first couple years (at least) #2 was usually fairly timely here in North Florida. It left L.A. at the same time as now and ran all the way to Miami, normally arriving before midnight. Now it is hard pressed to make Orlando by then.

quote:

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Originally posted by SilverStar092:
Interesting comments by Notelvis and Geoffm. The problems with adjusting the schedule of the Sunset is that it does a lot of connecting business with the Coast Starlight and can't leave L.A. earlier. One alternative would be to route connecting passengers via a San Joaquin and, egads, Ambus from Martinez to L.A. which would allow #2 to depart at least a couple hours earlier. This scenario would still allow most points to connect either via the San Joaquins or a Surfliner but would perhaps turn some people off as they'd have to ride coach and a bus all day. The main negative impact would be on San Antonio which would be scheduled in the wee hours.

A restored NOL-Florida Gulf Wind would not be able to leave New Orleans any later than #2 is currently scheduled as 10:30pm is late enough.

Trains magazine has a decent article about the semi-meltdown at UP.

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Good points all and I agree that 10:30pm is pretty much as late of an eastbound departure from New Orleans that would be practical.

Making an earlier number 2 from Los Angeles work connection-wise would probably require the return of an overnight train from Sacramento and the Bay Area to LAX. ('Spirit of California' anyone?)

Essentially, messing with the schedule is merely a bandaid though. It does nothing about the root cause which has always been, and continues to be, absolutely horrible timekeeping.....and padding the schedule hasn't done much good either.

When the Superliner equipment started running to Miami, someone "in their omnipotent wisdom' decided that the shop forces at Hialeah were not qualified to maintain the Superliner equipment and, owing to turnover and other factors best not discussed at a public message board, it wasn't "worth it" to conduct training classes to qualify the mechanical employees holding seniority at that facility on Superliner equipment.

Accordingly, mechanical employees were "pulled" from other facilities about the system to service the Superliner equipment when such was at HIA. This not only resulted in transportation, meals, and lodging being paid to the employees being "shipped in", it also resulted in disruption of their personal lives. Anyone having done it knows how business travel has a way of "getting old" usually after about a year of doing it with any regularity!!

While I do not condone in any way incidents of sabotage and even violence this practice reportedly brought about, I do condemm the responsibilities at Amtrak that chose to publicly tell a class of employees within the mechanical crafts that "you aren't good enough". Anyone here who has participated in "leadership seminars/workshops" over the years knows you "praise in public, criticize in private'; somebody back then, broke those rules.