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I'd like to clear up some questions and minor confusion on this board, as well as lend my knowledge to other F40 fans out there. Unfortunately, there isn't any good news, so prepare yourself. The last bastian of F40 usage, trains 63 and 64, switched to P40s sometime around November 1, 2001. Around this time, all Albany-based units were recalled to the shops and lined up. On November 25, train 49 was observed deadheading three F40s believed to be 227, 228, and 245, between its usual P42 power. On December 6, CSXT local B-761 transported 203, 206, my 207, 210, 258, 286, 300, and 310 to Selkirk for later shipment to the great roundhouse in the sky in Indiana. On January 6, train 49 was seen transporting 278, 304(?), and one other F40 between its usual power. Engine 268 was seen in service December 31 and January 14. Engine 265 was seen in service earlier this week. 414 remains in Albany due to lack of a front coupler. I'm sorry the news is not any better for the F40 nuts like myself. I do not know what is happening south of Albany or out of New Haven, but I'd assume it is similar. I knew this was going to happen, but I still let it sneak up on me. You'd think I could start to understand the warning signs since they started in 1993. As long as they don't make a cabbage out of 210......
Posts: 391 | From: Schenectady | Registered: Jan 2002
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I figured that Amtrak would sell or lease the F40s to the commuter agencies who use them; and there are still quite a few... I know they've leased a few. Amtrak could make some money, and the commuter agencies could save some.
Posts: 553 | From: Flagstaff, AZ USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Here's what I can add as of 12/29/01.. F-40 271 was used to help haul GE 5 on the Boston section of the Westbound LakeShore. 271 didn't continue on to Chicago, so I'm assuming it's still in service to help get the LakeShore over the Berkshires.
1/3/02 Observed F-40's in New Haven, but didn't get engine numbers- was too dark out. Right now, those units are used only for back-up power, as GE's have replaced them on the NHV-SPG line as well as the Vermonter (change happened this summer) and the inland route.
Not much new info there, but I rode when 271 was in service just a month ago.
-Tim
Posts: 140 | From: Albany, NY | Registered: Mar 2001
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Thanks for the input LSL. I also saw 271 as the second-to-last unit in regular service. I've been informed that 271 did some MBTA duty a few years back; it wouldn't surprise me to see it end up there.
------------------ In memory of F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001
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I believe 414 was the one that hit the freight train, which explains why it has no front coupler and cannot be transported unless they hook it up on the back.
------------------ ~F40PHR 231
Posts: 82 | From: Irvine, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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Check City of New Orleans route to NOL-CHI, F's have been spotted hauling tr's 58 & 59, peaceeeeeeeeeeeeee
Posts: 4 | From: lawerenceville,ga us | Registered: Feb 2002
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I saw 413 on the eastbound LSL 2/07. She wasn't at full throttle and the motor was making a light banging noise, so I'm assuming tractive power only. Nice to have another "Last Sighting" though. ST, what is what? Look at my screen name and put two and two together. Who is "we" anyway? I know 226 is destined for MBTA as well. A fellow friend informs me it will "probably be a while" before 414 is repaired enough to be moved. Yes, that engine was the leader on train 286 Feb. 5, 2001 in the "extreme helper" situation. The second unit, 411, was seen in extensive Maple Leaf service over the summer. I am unsure which cars were involved there, but most should be back in service by now.
------------------ In memory of F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001
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Here in So Cal there is a F40, I think it's 297, sitting probably as a spare, at the Coaster maint. center right next to the 5 freeway by Camp Pendelton. That is the only F40 I've seen since they've been using the 59's. I also saw what I think is a 40 dressed up like a Surfliner ( saw it once and for a split sec, could be a 59ph...)
------------------ Buslady of SoCal Long Live Crown Coach!
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381, 383, 399, and 415 (others?) have been overhauled and painted into the Surfliner colors. I believe these included serious modifications instead of just another motor or something like that. Some may argue they aren't 'true' F40s anymore. If you spot ANY, get a number and pass it along. I wouldn't be surprised to see a few favorites of the Chicago shop still banging around, especially 278.
------------------ In memory of F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001
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Never knew why Amtrak had to get rid of the F-40's. They seem to work as well or better than the crap Genesis engines that can barely get out of their own way & are breaking down left & right. Sure got a lot of express & reefer cars too, wonder why the NATIONAL rail PASSENGER corporation didn't buy any PASSENGER cars except the ASSela coaches? Sorry for ranting but I'm mad as hell about the possible destruction of the NATIONAL rail system! Reggie
Posts: 462 | From: Bakersfield Ca., 93312 | Registered: Jul 2000
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Reggie, I feel your pain. I think around here they call it being passionate. Many of us do not want to see the end of the national system, and others still hope it will not come to that. I was annoyed at myself for not documenting the end of the F40 reign better and missing the last day of service. Nothing is permanent in the RR world; I just wish I could've accepted that before the engines left for good. As much as I will tell anyone my #207 could outlast any microprocessor-controlled P40 they will counter with fuel usage and the reliability of a 25 year old locomotive that ran at full throttle when it was standing still. Unfortunately, I still believe the F40 was a better product in many ways. I don't think the Genesei are like 200+ modern P30s, but I do have my questions about them breaking down and catching fire and blowing motors on occasion. At least for the next five years, the F40 will be underappreciated and scrapped. After then it's too late. Remember most Es and Fs are beer cans right now. Unfortunately that's how a locomotive lives. I think some new Dining cars for the eastern routes were near the top of the list, but that funding seemed to get, uh, how else can I put this? That funding always got McCained at the last minute. I've already made my feelings toward his job performance known. The mail and express cars were brought aboard so they could do whatever they could to meet the nonsense "self-sufficiency" guideline put in place by a hostile and unreasonable group of legislators. This resulted in a shift in priorities from overhauling the infrastructure to making enough money to satisfy these hypocrites. As for AEX trainsets, I think it is still too early for me to make a judgement toward their reliability, safety, and usefulness. I will not argue they have made money for their company and finally allowed a new level of service to exist on the NEC. Outside the NEC will take time, money, and sensible politics, an oxymoron. Out my way in the territory of the dual mode P32s, the book gets even more interesting when somebody points out that 706 and 700 are sitting in Erie with blown motors due to excessive crankcase pressure. (Anybody out there seen 714 lately?) In contrast to the F40, that is horrible. A younger Amtrak wouldn't be able to absorb that loss. Can the older one? F40s were pulled from use because of their age, not their reliability. One of the last uses for 207 was on the 100 mph runs out of New Haven this summer. Did they retire the older unit to a lower (60 or 79) speed track? No way! The engines were kind of tired, and some were scrapped or cannibalized, others were wrecked, and some were just loud, but the rest outlasted their economic design lives. As an aspiring (civil) engineer, I look at the F40 model and see a job for the record books. The fact that they are being converted into cab cars, commuter units, and freight engines shows how flexible the model was. I'd like to take the chief engineer on the F40 design team out to lunch. They obviously didn't just design a 3000 hp locomotive, they made it too well.
------------------ In memory of F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001
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amtrak 207 im sure you have probably been asked this before but whats the story behind f40ph 757099-8? thanks in advance
Posts: 175 | From: FENCE WI USA | Registered: Oct 2000
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Amtrak207: I've enjoyed reading about the F40 from you and others -- you seem to have a lot of F40 under your hat, and I appreciate you sharing.
The F40 has a worthy companion in aviation: the C-47 (aka DC-3, Skytrain, and Gooney Bird). Built in 1936, and built TOO well, she's still in service, just like the F40.
(Railfanners: Apologies in advance for the air stuff -- I know this is a RAIL board, but hoped you wouldn't mind me drawing a pretty neat parallel between two grand old ladies. Anyway, back to the layout and work on that difficult turnout...)
Signed, An Ol' Air Force Guy Who Prefers Rail
Posts: 52 | From: Lithia, Fl, USA | Registered: Oct 2001
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372 was the spare engine parked at the Coaster MainT. Facil. at Stuart Mesa. Will look for it next time I go by. All the Surfliner F40s have been sent back east.
Posts: 249 | From: Downey CA USA | Registered: Jul 2000
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Power on train 49 of February 26-27 included 263, yet another northeastern engine I've never seen until now. Yet another last sighting; something tells me I will be having last sightings of F40s for as long as Amtrak is around.
------------------ F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001 P42DC #53063 November 18, 2001-???
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As of yesterday AMT 372 is parked on the siding on the wye at Miramar Jct.
Posts: 249 | From: Downey CA USA | Registered: Jul 2000
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F40 #372 is my favorite F40. I took a trip to San Diego in 1998, and it was on the point of a San Diegan. The engineer spotted me, and invited me into the cab. I got to take a couple of pictures and ask a few questions... It was my first cab visit, so I wanted to spend a lot of time up there, but the engineer was worried that someone would see an "unauthorized" railfan in the cab, and get him in trouble. It was still very fun!
Posts: 553 | From: Flagstaff, AZ USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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207's older. Ha ha narf. Nice to see other favorites out there. I'm not the only insane one!
Posts: 391 | From: Schenectady | Registered: Jan 2002
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Which is gonna become a cabbage first? The older the unit, the faster it happens! (Actually, I don't have any evidence!) Of course we're insane, we're railfans!
Posts: 553 | From: Flagstaff, AZ USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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I don't care AS LONG AS IT'S NOT 210! I hope Amtrak management and shop forces have enough sense to not do that! By the way, the first cabbage was 90368. Your theory out the window. Ha!
Posts: 391 | From: Schenectady | Registered: Jan 2002
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My favorite loco is #231, Operation Lifesaver. I don't think there really is an issue of which cabbage is to get built next, we've already got 90220 and 90368.
I sincerely hope they convert the 231 to a cabbage, cause Amtrak won't use it as a regular engine anymore. There is a 90230, so it's possible.
#372 is leased by RailWorld to Coaster, mostly as a switcher at Stuart Mesa. Is no longer owned by Amtrak.
#281 still hangs out in Redondo facility in LA, don't know what's up with that engine.
Next time I see #231, I'm just gonna die. I have a lot of sentimental value with that engine. I want to win the lottery, buy it, and store it in a museum.
When I was a little kid, I took some pictures and some videotapes of passing trains. Turns out that more than 5 out of 8 Amtrak photos I took was the #231. Of course, I didn't know that then, but now that I look back in my archives... It was unbelieveable.
~Chris
Posts: 82 | From: Irvine, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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Chris, you are also forgetting former San Diego units #213 (#90213), #214 (#90214), all of the #250-series units (except #254), and #229 (#90229). By the way, what ever happened to Amtrak F59PHI #455. Have not seen the thing around SLO or over in the Valley. Last time I saw it, it was leading the last westbound Metra BNSF train to Aurora, Ill. back in November.
I would like to see that thing back into California soon.
posted
No I did not forget the other NPCUs, I've got the complete list here, but didn't bother to write it all down. Most recent NPCU entered in service is #90340.
~Chris
Posts: 82 | From: Irvine, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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90340 came through on the Chief (#3) a few months ago. It looks a lot nicer now with its new paint!
Posts: 553 | From: Flagstaff, AZ USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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I am aware of most of the cabbages; I know 208 is one after my fave and it's been done. The reason I don't want to see a cabbaged 210 is because when they do the cabbage conversion they add the digits 9 and 0 in front of the original number, and an Amtrak 90*** would never be taken seriously.
------------------ F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001 P42DC #53063 November 18, 2001-???
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AMT 293, and 311, left New Orleans yesterday on train #1. I heard they were going to El Paso, to be sold to RailWorld.
Posts: 13 | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote:Originally posted by irish1: amtrak 207 im sure you have probably been asked this before but whats the story behind f40ph 757099-8? thanks in advance[/b]
I'll play detective 757099-8 is the builder's number for AMT 207 The dates are its Build date and retirement date.
[This message has been edited by JAChooChoo (edited 03-21-2002).]
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That's correct. The old 207 was delivered with 209 on April 29, 1976 and officially retired to make way for the P42 of the same number, which was delivered last November 18 from GE.
Recent rumors of her renumbering to 418 and going back into service have proven false.
As for the forum, I think it's cooled down a bit; I plan to pull it within the next week or so barring any serious protests or new F40 developments or sightings. It's been fun!
------------------ F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001 P42DC #53063 November 18, 2001-???
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There's a new rumor, #288 on a Downeaster and #231 in South Hampton yard! I'm still awaiting confirmation from 3 sources cause I won't believe it till I hear from one of those 3, or see a picture.
~231
Posts: 82 | From: Irvine, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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Got word, 288 IS on the downeaster. 231 is at Southhampton awaiting the secision as to where it is going.
Posts: 2 | Registered: Feb 2002
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A bit of a tardy update: A good friend of mine left me an urgent message on May 31 saying that westbound Empire Service train 283 that night would have a pair of F40s on it. I picked up a friend and headed for the station. Sure enough, in rolls the train with 280 on the point and 271 trailing. These engines were configured as they were designed to with the leader providing traction and the trailer supplying head end power to the trainset. It was a great experience, hearing 271 blasting away like that. My friend shot a very good video of the train arriving and I took a bunch of pictures. I can not wait until those are developed and returned to me. The train departed, we bought some drinks and toasted the occasion, and I brought friend home. Then, as I sat in my basement, the thought hit me. Train 283 reverses to become train 288 on sundays. A very fast decision later, I had reserved tickets for a short ride, just to be able to say I rode behind an F40 (two, actually) one last time.
It was a great trip. I hope to take another one for the same reason soon.
------------------ F40PH #757099-8 March 29, 1976-November 18, 2001 P42DC #53063 November 18, 2001-???
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