posted
I took the Canadian in coach from Toronto to Vancouver May 24th-27th. I had a blast. I took it for one main reason: so I could ride in a dome car. The following is a relatively short trip report:
I arrived at Toronto Union Station about two hours before the train was due to depart on Saturday Morning, May 24th. Boarding began about 8:30 for the 9:00 departure. I was happy that the car attendant spaced single travelers like myself throughout the car, giving us each two seats. (i know Amtrak sometimes likes to cram people in like sardines). I knew that it was unlikely that i would get to keep the two seats to myself for the entire trip (though it turned out i did get the two seats all the way).
I would say about half of the coach car was full as we pulled out of the station at almost exactly 9:00. After tickets were collected, i headed to the dome car, where i would remain on and off for about half of the three day journey!
The view from the dome was great as the train reached the Ontario countryside. One thing i noticed is the dome had the front seats facing towards the rear of the car, so people sitting in the front two rows faced each other. I thought that was a waste of a prime seating location, and know it wasnt like that when i rode a dome on Amtrak in the mid 90's.
The train continued on through rural Ontario. I never dreamed it would be so beautiful. Endless lakes with neat little cottages.
In the afternoon, I was starting to feel a little hungry, so i went to find the snack bar. I knew it was on the main level of the dome car. I walked along the entire car but ended up at the restaurant. Thats not what i wanted so i turned around and found the attendant hanging out in a small room next to the walkway. Turns out this was the snack shop! I thought that was pretty funny.
The entire trip I just bought snacks from the snack shop. I thought the food was pretty good-- lots of good soups, burgers, yogurt etc. I thought about visiting the cafe but never did.
I got off the train at a rest stop in Winnipeg and visited a market nearby to get a sandwich. Pretty nice market there with lots of snacks and healthfoods, in addition to souvenirs. But since the train was only stopped in Winnipeg for an hour, I wasnt able to see everything.
The second night the train crossed Saskatchewan and Alberta, arriving in Edmonton in the middle of the day. At Edmonton, there was time to walk the length of the train. I believe I counted 23 cars counting the baggage car.
I quickly returned to my seat in the dome car because i knew the dome would be in hot demand as we crossed the rockies. During my time riding in the dome, i discovered i actually liked the back seat best because you could get a good second look at things of interest as they passed by. And the best thing about the coach dome was it was the closest dome to the front of the train, providing great views over the F40's. I also got to know some of my fellow passengers, including a guy who said he was "canoeing across Canada". On this trip he said he was going from The Pas, Manitoba to Winnipeg.
We stopped in Jasper for about 45 minutes. Here they washed the car windows (including all dome car windows).
Going through the rockies was great. I spotted six black bears at various points. That was probably the best part. The mountains were great (especially Mt Robson, highest point in the Canadian Rockies) but i think the Amtrak's Zephyr has better mountain scenery when you take both the Rockies and Sierra's into account. Rural Ontario also was much nicer then I expected, but what makes this trip truly great (in my opinion) is the dome though.
We arrived in Chillewack, BC about two hours behind schedule and then came to a halt just 5-10 miles west of there. We were told they were conducting a crew change. Well we sat there for about three hours. We didnt arrive into Vancouver until after 1, a few hours later than we were supposed to. They made an announcement that everyone on the train would be eligible for up to 50% off a future trip on VIA Rail. Ill keep that in mind should I take this trip again next year!
In Vancouver I stayed in a hostel for two nights right on the bay. First night was beautiful, and I enjoyed hanging out by the bay. After my stay in Vancouver I took the Cascades train to Seattle. Nice trip, but didnt know it would be in the Superliner Cars. Definitely has some scenic stretches, but next time ill probably leave Vancouver in the morning by bus so I can have more time in Seattle.
Then it was on to Seattle, where I spent two nights in a hostel next to Pike Place Market. Saw a Mariners game at their nice new ballpark. Then it was time to hop on Southwest Airlines for the trip back to DC.
A very good trip indeed, and I hope to take The Canadian again (maybe next year???)
Posts: 416 | From: St. Albans, Vermont | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
With proper recognition to Messrs. Crosby, Stills & Nash:
Wouldn't you know we're riding on the Masochist Express Wouldn't you know we're riding on the Masochist ExpressPosts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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C'mon, Mr. Norman!!! How can you call the Canadian the "masochist express?" (probably because Jim rode the whole trip in coach, eh?)
Jim -- glad you had a good trip. My wife and I just took the Canadian the other way, from Vancouver to Toronto, last week, and it was great!! Next time you take that train, I would suggest you try the "silver and blue" (sleeper) class. You will get a lot more amenities, such as free champagne in the dome at various points, use of the rear-end Park car, etc. Plus your meals are included in the fare, and you will be much more comfortable. (I believe Mr. Norman would agree....)
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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RRRich, GBN is a man of ironclad opinions, but he has a sense of humor about them!
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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quote:Originally posted by RRRICH: C'mon, Mr. Norman!!! How can you call the Canadian the "masochist express?" (probably because Jim rode the whole trip in coach, eh?)
Affirm
Even thought I have not set foot on VIA Rail since 1980 (Toronto to Montreal overnight on the Cavalier), I'll certainly accept the volumes of comments that VIA's on-board travel experience is far superior to that of Amtrak.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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posted
i would take sleeper if i could afford it. 1500.00 dollars is not cheap for me though, and that was the price of the cheapest sleeper on this trip. I know i know, some say if you cant take a sleeper dont go, but id rather go. Yes i was a little tired from sleeping upright for three nights, but i had a blast. and much better then sitting in hard seat on the trains in china, which i rode quite a bit when i was there.
given that, the one problem i have with going coach is people yapping on their cell phones at all hours and the lights. Amtrak doesnt seem to turn down the lights much at night anymore.
so there are definite advantages to going sleeper, and once a year or two i try it, but unless i hit the lottery ill be going coach.
Posts: 416 | From: St. Albans, Vermont | Registered: Feb 2003
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Unlike some who say sleeper or no trip, to save $500 a night, I would sleep under a bridge, so to go in railroad coach for that much difference between coach and sleeper is a no-brainer. If we were talking airplane coach versus business class for something like trans-Pacific, that would be a different story. $500 for the extra room I might consider worth it now in the 60 plus age range. In the 50 plus range, I did not.
Posts: 2808 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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Jim, thanks so much for your report. You've given me pause about the possibilities of going coach on the Canadian! I want to do it, and take the Skeena too . . .
I am amzed at the high sleeper price, though; I could have sworn it was less when I checked the fares, esp in May.
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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Oh well, at least I got my Trans-Canada rides during 1965, or when the CN Red White Blue "giveaway" fare initiative was "in full bloom". As I recall, the CN fare Winnipeg to Vancouver was about CD$65 in a Roomette; CD$75 returning on the CP with their "half hearted" Faresaver plan.
In both cases, meals were included; however on the CP, they let it be known anyone holding such ticket was a "second class citizen'. CP "signature" dishes such as steaks, chops, and Prime Rib were all off limits - a surcharge was not offered. The "on limits" were casseroles, which likely were also the "crew hash'. First night out, I "accepted" the facts of life, second night, I simply forfeited the coupon and had the excellent Prime Rib (had it once again in this life aboard the "Princess Margaret" during 1974).
Mr. Royal previously reported here that CP subsequently modified that policy and allowed "Faresaver" passengers anything on the Menu, but such as I noted was prevalent during 1965.
Finally, as Ms. Sojourner notes, VIA fares have gone up dramatically for anyone paying in US$; lest we note that until the US$ became "Monopoly Money', VIA fares were paid with "seventy five cent pieces'; not so anymore with the two currencies now trading roundly @ parity.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Sojourner, maybe VIA Rail is kiting the fares owing to fuel prices? Or maybe, like Amtrak, it uses yield management to massage fares?
I'm glad Debby and I took the Canadian last fall after booking (and paying for) the tickets the previous March, when the US dollar still enjoyed a 9 per cent advantage over the loonie. It was expensive, still, compared to Amtrak sleepers, but the ambience -- and the cuisine! -- made it worth every penny.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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Supply and demand. VIA can price out the Canadian because they know they can fill the sleepers with the prices they set, and they offer a good product. Offseason (i.e. November-May) prices are often dramatically cheaper.
Posts: 337 | Registered: Jun 2003
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JP, that was what surprised me; Montana Jim said he was pricing it for end of May. Perhaps offseason fares now end May 15?
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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I'm given to understand that Via, unlike Amtrak, does not use yield management. For The Canadian during the high summer season a drawing room for one person, Toronto to Vancouver, is $4109 in early October, yet just a month later it drops to $2589-- about a 40% difference (price includes GST). This is the fare for the highest priced accommodation, and it does not vary by day of the week or last minute sell-offs. There are also certain special fares such as a senior and youth fares, and whether or not a ticket is purchased more than seven days in advance of travel. Unlike Amtrak, Via does not offer a great deal of different fares, so The Canadian can be quite expensive depending on the time of year and the accommodation you choose. But if you travel in the off season, and not take something as grand as a drawing room, then this train is really quite affordable.
Posts: 524 | From: Toronto Ont. Canada | Registered: Mar 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Henry Kisor: Sojourner, maybe VIA Rail is kiting the fares owing to fuel prices? Or maybe, like Amtrak, it uses yield management to massage fares?
...
VIA just recently raised their fares for the first time in about a year and a half. The rate of increase for the Canadian was a mere 2%; it was 5% for all other routes.
Unusual for VIA, there are now sell-offs on the Canadian and certain other trains. The list is updated every Wednesday. Note that there are no refunds nor exchanges allowed on these 50% discounted tickets.
posted
The one thing I didn't like about our VIA fare (bedroom on the Canadian) was that VIA charges a full accomodation charge for EACH OF US. On AMTRAK, for 2 people, you generally pay one accomodation charge per room, plus each person's basic coach rail fare.
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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RRRich, one reason you see so many geezers on The Canadian is that they are taking advantage of the "senior companion fare" -- if both of you are 65 or over the second one gets 80 per cent off the fare AND accommodation.
Conversely, Amtrak gives us geezers just a 15 per cent break on the fare only.
It's hard to compare apples and oranges here, though. Meals aren't included in most VIA sleeper fares, except for the Canadian.
This senior companion fare apparently is not available for all accommodations, too. When I priced a trip from Montreal to Halifax on the Ocean the other day, the senior companion fare was not available for a regular bedroom on that train, but it was for a deluxe bedroom, and the two prices were nearly identical.
(The deluxe BR includes a shower.)
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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I have a few comments on the two previous postings.
At one time VIA priced the sleepers as Amtrak does. Although it may seem that you are being charged the accommodation charge for each person, that charge in a double room or triple room (traditionally called drawing room) is based on an appropriate portion of the room. In other words, in a double room each passenger is paying half the difference between the coach fare and the full sleeper fare. In the traditional Budd-built sleepers on the Canadian, the Hudson Bay and the Chaleur, the fare for each of two in a double room is exactly the same as the fare for one in a single bedroom (roomette in the traditional terminology.) If one passenger wants to occupy a double bedroom the supplement is 50% over the cost of a roomette or the per person fare for the double room – which is the same thing.
In Renaissance rooms on the Ocean, single occupancy costs a mere 15% supplement because of the unavailability of single rooms.
VIA’s definition of “geezer” is 60 or older and the second person on the seniors’ companion offer can be any age. In coach the second person travels free; in sleepers the discount is 75%. The catch on the sleeper deal is that the senior’s fare is based on the full senior’s fare for the season, whether peak or off-peak, meaning the advance-purchase discount is not available. That is irrelevant in the summer season, of course.
As Mr. Kisor says, the seniors’ discount in sleepers is not always available. Unlike Amtrak, VIA does not use “yield management” in sleeper fares, but for they do use that system for the availability of the seniors’ companion offer. It can be quite difficult to get that discount on the Canadian and Ocean during busy periods. I have a greater interest in this discount now that my wife has turned 60.
Posts: 216 | From: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 2000
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David, thanks for the corrections. Had I known that geezers on VIA are five years younger than geezers on Amtrak, we'd have taken the Canadian long ago.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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Henry dear, geezers on Amtrak are 62, just two years older than VIA. And no one seems to mention the VIA sections - my husband and I rode the Canadian in a section and loved it.
The berths are much bigger and more comfortable than the Amtrak roomette berths and you have two bathrooms - one for men, one for women - that are only shared by the six people in the sections. And there is room to dress in the bathroom. More economical that those bedrooms.
-------------------- Vicki in usually sunny Southern California Posts: 951 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Aug 2006
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Vicki: Dayumn! Geezerdom starts at 62 on Amtrak? What I must have missed!
I was tempted to go partway on our trip on The Canadian in a section, but my wife wanted more privacy, so we opted for a bedroom. The savings with a section are considerable, though.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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After reading about the great savings on ViaRail if you are over 60, I decided to book a "senior companion fare" on a double berth for a trip from Toronto to Vancouver in March. The price for the two of us was a little over $1200..About twice as much as a comparable Amtrak trip,but with a $600 savings with the senior fare I decided we should go for it. I turn 60 next year, so a little present for myself.
I last took the Canadian in March of 06 and I still marvel at what an incredible train journey that is. The best food I ever had was on that train, and that alone justifies the price!..not to mention the great scenery and just being on that historic train. Starting in December the train leaves on Thursday night and arrives in Vancouver on Monday morning..so an extra 11 hours on the train with a 4 hour layover in Winnipeg. I think I could handle that!
Posts: 176 | From: Bloomsburg Pa | Registered: Jul 2000
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I'd happily go in a section if I could share one with Marilyn Monroe.
(VIA Rail ought to play that "Some Like it Hot" scene with Jack Lemmon (or was it Tony Curtis? I forget) in TV ads to promote travel by section.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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