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A friend has bought a ticket from Toronto to New York City later this month. When he picked up his ticket he was told by the agent at the station here that it is two trains and he will have to change trains. The schedule on amtrak.com DOES show two train numbers but there is only a 4 minute connect time! Is this possible?
Thanks for any advice and suggestions to make his trip more pleasant. He did book Business Class.
Frank in Sunny SBA
Posts: 2160 | From: Santa Barbara, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 2003
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Rest assured to John Q, the Msple Leaf is a through train; your local Ticket Clerk is quite mistaken in this case.
To those knowledgable Amtrak operates the train NYP to CBN (location code for Canadian Bridge Niagra); thence the equipment becomes a VIA train CBN to Toronto. Through passengers may remain on the train while immigration formalities are completed.
The ticket is simply an interline ticket - while once quite common in passenger railroading, this is the only instance of such today on the Amtrak system involving trains (others are the various Thruway bus arrangements).
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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NOT EXACTLY ANSWERING YOUR QUESTION, BUT HERE'S A SEGMENT OF TRAVELOG FROM A TRIP OF MINE. Ah! Into the "big Apple" in the (almost) wee hours. Since I am traveling with two ladies on a 17 day excursion, I have just a "wee" bit more luggage than I want to cart around. Up to baggage check, and "surprise!" - didn't read the schedule like I should have - NO CHECKED BAGGAGE NYP-TOR! Well, are there lockers at Niagra Falls since I don't need them and don't want to drag them to a hotel and back? No - there are NO baggage facilities of any kind. Well, it says "Adirondack" takes baggage to Montreal, and VIA carries it from Montreal to Toronto, so how about shipping it that route? Nope - no "unattended" baggage carried - curses, foiled again. So, "parcel check" the unneeded bags and off to a hotel. Anyhow, get grandma to the "obigatory" statue - Emp State tower, Xmas Tree, skating rink, etc, then an early AM "Maple Leaf" to Niagra Falls. Consist is cafe, 2 amfleet, 3 horizons (1 will be pulled at Albany) Get my first ride thru the "connector" to the river line, then head up to Albany. We roll into Niagra Falls NEW YORK, and as advertised, it is nothing but a box in deteriorating yards (but there are taxis waiting). Per advice from several people, we remain on the train for a couple of miles, cross the impressive bridge over the Niagra gorge, and stop at the VIA station just across the river. There is no announcement by the Amtrak crew of what's happening, they just bail off the train - (I have inquired of the conductor earlier if he knows the VIA scanner frequency and his answer is "we don't talk to or associate with those people since they screwed the conductors and a/c's out of their jobs") OK - this isn't "PC", but "bull-dike" is the ONLY description that fits of what we encounter next. People are wandering around (yes, we "know" this is customs, but nothing has been announced), when the "BD" storms in with "TAKE YOUR SEATS" and blows thru the car with no other explanation. She works from the front of the train back (there are only about 30 people on the whole train at this point), and "pounces" on a young pair of oriental youths who do not speak english (she never asks if they speak French). She grills them over and over about where they are going - who they will be seeing - do they have jobs - etc. etc. The most that is communicated is that they are going to Toronto (as their tickets say) and that "someone" is meeting them. The "BD" continues with the "learn english dam fast and start talking to me or you're NOT getting into Canada on MY train", but nothing else is communicated, so she tells them they are "history", "hat-checks" their seats, and moves on to us. My wife has been observing the previous exchange, but decides to "read a book" until the "BD" gets to her. Before uttering anything else, she spits a "out of RESPECT you could at least put the book down" at my wife, who complies but does a "slow burn" since she's not particularly into "intimidation". Anyhow, we have no problems, but there is an hour scheduled for customs, and apparently "BD" feels she has to justify her job so we sit for nearly the full hour before a VIA attendant pops into the coach with "passengers may detrain now". NOW I wish I had detrained on the NEW York side. Cab distance would have been virtually the same to the hotel, I would have been one-on-one with border customs, and wouldn't have spent an extra hour sitting on the train - so much for seeking advice! Anyhow, it's off to a hotel (Sheraton Fallsview - very nice), get wet in the spray, and back to the same train the next afternoon (in a requested van as we had trouble getting all the luggage into a sedan on the way to the hotel). Into the VIA station (which we went arounf on the outside to a cab when we arrived, and VOILA! Banks of luggage storage lockers! (more incorrect advice). Off to Toronto - VIA crew (as on another trip), only knows their radios pick up VIA-1 or VIA-2, and have no idea of frequency or channels, so I'll try later. Crew also does not use "hat-checks" for passenger on-off's. I comment, but they say with only 4 stops, they have no problems keeping track of on-off's without the checks (is Amtrak more complex, or are hat-checks a "rule" in the US?) Into Toronto, at Royal York Hotel adjacent to the station and connected to the "underground city". Very plush old (renovated) hotel $115 (US) - good value. "Underground" maps are either "straightline" (not much help) or "diagrams", but the accuracy does not match a lot of the twists and turns, so it's easy to get confused. Since you can "pop up" upstairs anywhere (into some beautiful buildings) it's no big deal, and is well worth the walking.
Posts: 114 | From: pismo beach CA | Registered: Jul 2003
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My wife and I did this trip in this direction last August and despite warnings about its length thoroughly enjoyed. Business Class is an advantage; the accomodation is very roomy and the train does become crowded in the latter stages. You also have immediate access to refreshments from that class. There is no full meal service, something I think Amtrak should rectify on a journey of that length, and food/drinks can become scarce so it is advisable to take some extra rations. The food that was served was perfectly adequate and we were lucky in havig a very attentive cafe car attendant who went out of his way to be obliging, offering to supply blankets to those passengers who were feeling the cold. The border crossing is a bind, so make sure they have adequate reading material. On the Canadian section the liquid refreshments must be paid for, after Niagara they are free. In Toronto you have to queue before boarding the train and you will be supplied with Amtrak luggage labels. Although there is no checked baggage system on the train there is ample room to store luggage. The scenery, while not spectacular as far as Albany, is pleasant, giving glimpses of small town US life which is so typical of train travel. In Buffalo you have a glimpse of the now derelict but still imposing station. From Albany there is the glory of the Hudson and at this time of year most of it should be done in daylight. It is almost as good as travelling along the Rhine by train; some would no doubt say even more beautiful! There is more river traffic to see on the Rhine. Albany station is a good place to stretch the legs,we were there the same time as the two sections of the Lake Shore met. I think the Boston section was probably late. There seemed to be some difference among Amtrak staff as to where photography was allowed; I think Amtrak has recently revised its ruling on this, but as I understand it bona fide travellers are allowed to take photos from the platform, as long as you keep out of the way. We were just over 25 minutes late into Penn station. There were delays earlier in the journey but staff kept us informed as to the reasons. I hope your friend finds the trip as enjoyable as we did.
Posts: 168 | From: uk. northumberland | Registered: Jun 2007
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The Maple Leaf must be one of the worst Amtrak trains given that it takes more than half a day to make the run between NYC and Toronto. There are no first-class facilites, no dining car and the business-class car is most inadequate for such a long journey. I have used this train many times, but for short trips, usually around two hours, between Toronto and Niagara Falls (the longest trip I ever took on this train was Rochester/Toronto. As for the "charming" customs inspectors, I must admit that I have not come across the character described by pisobum. However many people have suggested that detraining before the border and taking a taxi across will save you considerable time and aggravation. When I cross the U.S. Canadian border by car, it takes about three to five minutes for the inspection.
Posts: 524 | From: Toronto Ont. Canada | Registered: Mar 2001
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I've forwarded the messages from all of you to my friend. He's seriously considering cancelling the reservation and renting a car or booking a flight.
Frank in Sunny SBA
Posts: 2160 | From: Santa Barbara, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 2003
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I feel I must defend the Maple Leaf. No, it is not by any means our favourite nor the fastest Amtrak service and much of that is down to the painfully slow border-crossing. But if you are on holiday, or do not want to drive or fly it is perfectly viable and comfortable service, which would be improved with the addition of a full dining-car. You can relax, you can view the scenery and you are treated as a human-being; not simply aa a travel item to be processed, as happens at airports.
Posts: 168 | From: uk. northumberland | Registered: Jun 2007
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Well, the last time I had to travel from Toronto to Philadelphia (following a wonderful steam excursion on CP) I had a choice. I could take a 1:15 flight nonstop YTZ - PHL or spend 12 hours on the "Maple Leaf" plus two more on a connecting train and arrive home late at night.
I flew.
The train does run through, but when I rode it a VIA attendant was on the Amfleet snack car at Toronto. He had carefully covered the Amtrak menus with paper napkins, and was selling a selection of VIA snacks and Canadian beverages. He got off at Niagara Falls, ON, taking his inventory with him. An Amtrak attendant boarded at Niagara Falls, NY and unlocked the storage bins and freezers, took down the napkins, and was in business.
Long, slow ride to NYP.
Posts: 614 | From: Merchantville, NJ. USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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One of these days I must take the Maple Leaf from Toronto to a point beyond Niagara Falls. But when a decision has to be made, I always opt for flying, especially since the overnight train from Montreal to New York was discontinued. Last month we had to get to New York to board Cunard's Queen Mary 2 and I again seriously considered the Maple Leaf. But for the same price as an Amtrak business class ticket, I was able to fly from downtown Toronto to Newark on Porter Airlines. When I say the same price, the flight was actually way cheaper because I booked it long in advance, but the airport and government imposed taxes doubled our cheap fare to make it the same as Amtrak. Rail passengers crossing the border are spared these charges, three of which were imposed by the U.S. government and included a "U.S. agriculture tax" whatever that is!
I must point out that in just over an hour in the air, Porter Airlines gave us a box lunch and a glass of wine - and I do mean a "glass." Amtrak wouldn't give us anything more than juice in over 13 hours.
Posts: 216 | From: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 2000
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Correction: You won't even get juice for a 13 hour ride.
I've taken the Maple Leaf from Toronto to Albany, and it was an AWFUL RIDE. No dining car was what really did it in. The line for the cafe car with the incompetent Amtrak LSA never was below 10 people waiting. And she ran out of almost everything. That in combination with the Border Nazi's... NEVER AGAIN.
Posts: 54 | Registered: Oct 2006
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I must disagree with the above. As Amtrak state, we were well supplied with non-alcoholic drinks throughout the US part ofjourney, by a very obliging cafe car attendant. I suppose being on holiday and under no kind of pressure makes all the difference. Even the US passport control was human.
Posts: 168 | From: uk. northumberland | Registered: Jun 2007
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I have taken the Maple Leaf only between NY and Albany. Like all trains that go along the Hudson, this portion of the Maple LEaf trip is very very pretty. One should sit on the left side traveling north; the right side traveling south. If boarding in NYC, have a Red Cap put you on (he will help with the luggage; you will need to tip him) to ensure you get seated on the left side (for best Hudson River views). If for some reason you don't get the seat you like, get to the lounge early and sit there until Albany; the lounge often has the best views on this train anyway, even though it is just a regular lounge, not sightseer with the nice big windows, you can still usually see out both sides if you sit facing forward at one of the lounge tables.
I have also been to Toronto twice, once as a teenager by car, and once as an adult by plane. However, when I do go to Toronto again (which I expect to do one of these days, perhaps to catch the VIA Rail trans-Canada trip I am planning to take some time), I will absolutely take the Maple Leaf, since (a) I no longer fly and (b) I've never been on the track N of Buffalo and always like to travel on something new. I would anticipate a very long trip and slow border crossing, and would OF COURSE bring some of my own food--especially cookies, banana, other fruit--and music. Depending on the price, I would also try to get business class--would certainly do so if my husband were coming with me.
Luggage has never been a problem for me on these trains, even though you cannot check it--in fact, I almost never check luggage on trains where checking IS available, because I don't like to wait for it at the end of the trip. There is plenty of room at the front or back of each car for a suitcase (I just make sure I put nothing of great value in it) and on the shelf above the seat for a smaller one. I keep mine at the end; perhaps one day someone will make off with my suitcase by accident, but it hasn't happened yet! I generally travel with an overnight bag as well as my suitcase; I keep the overnight bag at my seat, and it is here I keep my music, snacks, a book, info about the trip (like a travelogue photocopied from USA RAil or such and perhaps a map), a little zipup running jacket (sweatshirt material, not sure what you call this--in case A/C is cold), a rollup hat (in case of sun in my eyes), little slipper shoes (so I can take my shoes off), an extra pair of socks, a small bottle of water, and various other things I think I might need. Sometimes for longer trips I bring a small pillow.
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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please correct me if I am wrong but from what I hear the air lines do not even "give" you juice. you can buy a pretty miserable meal.
Posts: 1577 | From: virginia | Registered: Jun 2005
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It depends on your airline of choice. Most still offer complimentary tea, coffee, soft drinks, and water. Some have free snacks (I think especially of Southwest) and at least one, Continental, still offers complimentary "meals at mealtime".
Frank in overcast and soon to be VERY crowded SBA
Posts: 2160 | From: Santa Barbara, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 2003
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Sojourner do remeber that there are certain foods you can not bring across either border. It used to be mostly fruits and meat but I don't know what changes have been made.But I would certainly check it out before entraining.
Posts: 1577 | From: virginia | Registered: Jun 2005
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I believe it's meat and fresh fruit and vegetables, Train Lady, though it may also be some dairy products and eggs. I'm not sure it applies to food you bring to eat yourself on the train before getting off, though. But anyway, it's definitely not a worry northbound--because everything I bring can easily be eaten up before the border! Southbound, I recall gobbling down some pate sandwiches from Premiere Moisson purchased in the Montreal train station before we reached the border, just in case some overly officious border guard tried to confiscate it. It was a very early lunch--but we had pastries and bread to see us through the rest of the trip. I suppose I'd do the same southbound from Toronto; in fact, I think it's a longer time till the border. Keep in mind we don't go all the way to NYC, too, so can have dinner when we get home (if the train is on time).
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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It is also plants. When we were coming into Michigan from Canada we had to leave our fruit when we crossed the border. We were driving and the food was for immediate use rather than the long haul, I know meat is or at least was not allowed. But as I am sure you know Governments change rules so often one needs a program to keep up.
Posts: 1577 | From: virginia | Registered: Jun 2005
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Yes, definitely no plants. But I don't take those! (Liquor too, but I wouldn't take that either.)
Actually, when I take the Maple Leaf, it's unlikely I'd take it southbound too. Chances are I'd either be taking it northbound to catch that long-planned trip on the VIA Rail Canadian, in which case I'd be coming home through Chicago, OR I'll take it sooner and make a loop, taking VIA Rail east and coming down from Montreal.
Posts: 2642 | From: upstate New York | Registered: Mar 2004
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