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There have been two improvements in train travel since 1954 so far as I am concerned. One is the banning of smoking. The other is the disappearance of coats and ties and fedoras.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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The two greatest innovations of the Amtrak era; 1) smoking prohibited and 2) the shower for all Sleeping Car passengers.
The greatest subtraction: 1) the dress code, or lack thereof.
Shorts, flip flops, and a tank top adorning an overweight middle aged male in the Diner (or let alone anywhere outside of one's room) simply is "out of line". Same on a "twentysomething" female; almost as bad.
Awful lot of holes that can be "shot" through that documentary; just a few:
1) Arrival by taxicab at Chicago Union Station; yet depart from Dearborn (correct for Santa Fe).
2) Departs on The Chief (don't think that was Chicago) yet arrives at Lamy on the Super.
3) The Pleasure Dome shown was assigned yto the Super; there was no need for a Lunch Car on the Super.
Shall I proceed?
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Richard, all the Western trains offered two classes of full-service dining in an era before reliable refrigeration and microwaves. Obviously, the "econodiner" on Amtrak has become the Snack Bar.
The Great Northern and Northern Pacific had their "econodiners' attractively decorated. GN's was the "Ranch" and in that motif. Northern Pacific's was the Travelers Rest and its motif was a history lesson of the Lewis and Clark expedition. The California Zephyr had the Cable Car Lounge, and the Denver Zephyr the Chuck Wagon.
However, those on the Santa Fe and Union Pacific were as spartan as that car shown in the documentary.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Mr. Norman - I didn't take many passenger trains, prior to 1971, but one I did take was the City of San Francisco. I can't remember what food services there were, aside from the dining car. Here is a great photo of one of their "Dome Lounge Car"..I assume it served light meals as well as beverages, but not sure.
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The UP 9000 Dome Lounges, which were very attractively decorated even if not quite "over the top" as is the one in the photo used from "executrain" service, however they were reserved for Pullman passengers and offered bar service only.
Here is a UP Dome Lounge in revenue service and how I recall the interiors decorated. Trust we note the at seat beverage service.
Depending upon what year you rode the City, food service may have only been an Automat. I rode 102 Sacramento-Ogden July 1968, and had "Dinner in the Diner'. Having just gotten back from Nam that morning, I think I was sound asleep somewhere around Auburn, and did not awake until about Wells.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman: The two greatest innovations of the Amtrak era; 1) smoking prohibited and 2) the shower for all Sleeping Car passengers.
The greatest subtraction: 1) the dress code, or lack thereof.
Shorts, flip flops, and a tank top adorning an overweight middle aged male in the Diner (or let alone anywhere outside of one's room) simply is "out of line". Same on a "twentysomething" female; almost as bad.
...
I agree. As with even the classiest of ships (Cunard) I have no objection to dressing comfortably, up to a point, during the day including breakfast and lunch in the dining car, but it's a pity that hardly anyone will wear a jacket and tie for dinner. Even I have given up wearing the traditional jacket and tie at dinner as I have no desire to be the only one. I think the wearing of baseball caps in dining cars should be banned, even if there is no other dress code - other than the requirement to wear clothes and shoes.
Posts: 216 | From: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 2000
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Splitting hairs but did anyone else notice that the 'westbound' train was departing Lamy towards Chicago?
-------------------- David Pressley
Advocating for passenger trains since 1973!
Climbing toward 5,000 posts like the Southwest Chief ascending Raton Pass. Cautiously, not nearly as fast as in the old days, and hoping to avoid premature reroutes. Posts: 4203 | From: Western North Carolina | Registered: Feb 2004
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Those of us from this era, and who know of the Santa Fe trains and territory, could nit-pick all day. I enjoyed the reminiscening but shall also point out several items that would be inconsistent with this trip on Train # 19, the Chief.
The train is shown leaving LAUPT, not Chicago; It is the fireman on the left side of the engine who is waving the hi-ball, not the engineer; as was pointed out the dome car is for the Super Chief as is the dinnerware which is the Mimbreno Pattern that in 1954 was exclusive to the Super; the several passing scenes are from many locations on the Santa Fe, the only one I was certain about being on a westbound train in Colorado was the scene with two prominent mountains which are the Spanish Peaks seen between La Junta and Trinidad; and the eastbound train leaving Lamy has the El Capitan drunhead.
But it was certainly meaningful to me to once again enjoy a train trip I have taken many times.
Posts: 467 | From: Prescott, AZ USA | Registered: Mar 2002
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Mr. RRCHINA - I did notice that the phone number, on the yellow cab, had a Calif. prefix.
Frank, yes, I missed the "neighbor" showing Bobby the pull-down wash basin, with the cigarette in his hand. Poor Bobby must have gotten a blast of secondhand smoke.
I can see why Chicago was, truly, the railroad hub of the country (and, I guess, still is). Looking at the big arrival/departure board, I see at least 3 trains from Chicago to Indiana..the Tippecanoe, Hoosier, and Thoroughbred. Also listed, the Pacific Express and Pekin Express...can't find anything about those trains.
In the first scene, what was Bobby's mother admonishing him about? Possibly smoking on the train?
Richard
Posts: 1909 | From: Santa Rosa | Registered: Jan 2004
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Pacific Express was the Erie's WB #7 "primarily mail and express train" and carded at 25hrs Hoboken-Chicago. EB #8 was named the "Atlantic Express".
The consist was about twenty Mail and Express cars - plus one Coach buried in the consist.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Rich- tried to open your link and got an "attack warning" of a possible malicious code? I'm sure your link is clean; maybe my permissions are set too strict- I'll see if I can go in by another port, since I really want to watch this 1954 piece.
My first train trip (outside Mom) was 10/1952. I was a babe-in-arms, traveling LAX-to CHI Dearborn on what else? the Cap. I was able to enchant the ATSF Courier Nurse and got a big kiss from her, Mom told me. Apparently I made the whole trip with no crying at all. The gentle, rocking beat and the rhythm of the rails was all I heard, even early on. And some warm milk.
Sadly I am no longer so adorably cute- except to Cynthia, the nice lady I make my life with.
Seasons greetings to all! from--> RR Bob
Posts: 588 | From: East San Diego County, CA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Railroad Bob: I don't know why you got the "attack warning" on my link. Try this one..you can, after a few seconds, click on "skip ad" to avoid the iniial advertisement:
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I agree with you all about the decline of appropriate dress standards, be they required or personal, on trains and planes. And I really agree about a middle aged male showing up in shorts, tank top, and flip flops for a meal. Eventhough I am in pretty good shape for 69 I would not inflict my physique on an unwary public trying to enjopy their meals and/or the scenery. Not only has this decline of sense of decorum occured in travel modes but I see it everywhere. Perhaps church is most noticable. In protest I may go crazy and wear a coat and tie on my next train trip!
Posts: 140 | Registered: Nov 2008
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While I suppose flip flops meet Amtrak's standards for suitable on-board footwear, so far as I'm concerned, they should not.
Scenario: small kid leaves assigned space, runs down aisle and drops a flip flop; traversing between cars...well you know the rest of the story.
I am appalled when I see airline passengers wearing them; for myself, I only relented post-9/11 to wearing slip on shoes. Prior to that, always the laced varietal.
My reasoning is that if the aircraft is to be involved in a survivable incident (other than?...well who cares) such as a runway excursion in which the hull remains largely intact, I would want secure footwear X-ing the inevitable debris field that surrounded the crash scene. No doubt the Flight Attendants would be yelling "RUN RUN RUN", and since I'm good for 1/4 mi of that even in my later years, I'd oblige them. But I would want secure footwear, and could only feel sorry for those who lost their flip flops upon the impact.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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On my May trip to and from Washington DC (for ISDC 2012) I packed two suits, a navy blazer with khakis, and a sport coat and slacks. I wore a coat (and usually a tie) to every meal on board, both ways. It was my personal protest against sloppy dress (which I must admit I have been guilty of many times in my younger days myself).
Posts: 413 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by notelvis: Splitting hairs but did anyone else notice that the 'westbound' train was departing Lamy towards Chicago?
I'm away from my timetables right now, but I do believe that the westbound Chief in 1954 arrived and departed Lamy at "oh-dark-thirty", well before sunrise. That wouldn't have photographed well.
ETA: In July 1954 the westbound Chief arrived Lamy at 5:43 a.m. Perhaps the filmmakers didn't want to send the message, "Take the train, and arrive before daybreak"...although, as New Mexico did not observe DST in 1954, the sun should have been just rising at that time. That eastbound El Capitan, however, arrived at a much more photogenic 8:00 a.m....hence, I suppose, the substitution.
-------------------- --------Eric H. Bowen
Stop by my website: Streamliner Schedules - Historic timetables of the great trains of the past! Posts: 413 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: Mar 2006
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Pursuant to the suits that suit us - it's the eyes of those who might peruse us where lies acceptability of how we dress - that's you or me.
I will add that scent as well affects my thoughts of a ne'er-dress-well. If dapper you appear - you stylin' - The smell of smoke is not beguilin'.
If fifties dining car decorum required fedora, then folks mighta wore'm. And if I wore to synagogue An inappropriate type of tog
I trust that God with lightining bolt Would strike me for no tie or coat, After all it is surely she With final word on what fashions be.
With no further point to what I rhyme I'll stop mid-stanza - but just this time.
Ira - bitter cold Denver, taking an unusual break from work to harass the hoi poloi with poetry
Posts: 300 | From: Denver, CO USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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Anybody who rhymes "decorum" with "wore'm" is a hero of mine.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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I really don't see what the big deal about dress code is, as long as you are wearing something, and wearing something that is clean. What offends me more is bad personal hygiene -- I've walked through coaches (from my sleeping car!) on many occasions, and you can tell who hasn't showered for the last week........
Posts: 2428 | From: Grayling, MI | Registered: Mar 2002
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Interesting video. What caught my eye was the observation car, Navajo, that was assigned to the Super Chief, not Chief. It is probably one of the few cars from that train that still survives almost 60 years later. Its current home is here.Posts: 2397 | From: Camden, SC | Registered: Mar 2006
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Palmland, by the early 50's the Super Chief had new equipment,like the dome car shown later in the film, and the Navajo was indeed used on the Chief.
Posts: 467 | From: Prescott, AZ USA | Registered: Mar 2002
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