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Some seats now recline by sliding the base forward so you don't get affected by the person in front reclining - that person loses kneeroom. Possibly the headrest rotates back a little, but certainly not as problematic as the original recline design.
-------------------- Geoff M. Posts: 2426 | From: Apple Valley, CA | Registered: Sep 2000
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Spirit Airlines pitch: 28 inches!!! Are you kidding me??? I mean, COME ON, that's got to be a joke!!!!
Posts: 2355 | From: Pleasanton, CA | Registered: Apr 2007
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I don't think I could survive much further than KORD-KHPN (the 2-1 seating Embraer that United's 'partner' operates certainly helps, but who knows what the 'partner' will be flying next trip); on that I have as good as no choice as my Sister worries about my driving. Possibly I should, but for the moment, stay within 2mph of posted speed, in the right lane, properly rested, and of course sober, seems to do me OK.
Overseas will just have to wait until the piggybank is overflowing enough for Business Class.
Finally, let it be noted that The Times article Mr. Kisor linked appears on the front page of the Print Edition.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman: Finally, let it be noted that The Times article Mr. Kisor linked appears on the front page of the Print Edition.
Slow news day? Nothing new to report so just rehash stuff that's been posted long ago in numerous forms. Sigh.
And they wonder why people move to digital media.
-------------------- Geoff M. Posts: 2426 | From: Apple Valley, CA | Registered: Sep 2000
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Yeah, must have been a very slow news day -- which is good, because nothing horrible happened.
Yet another of the many reasons why I refuse to fly. Bring back the way things were in, say, 1980, and I might consider it. Until then -- forget it!
And even if I could have afforded the super-luxury "pods" in the Singapore Airlines A 340 Ultra-Long Haul flights to Singapore, I would not have gone on that jet. Everyone is completely isolated for everyone else for more than 18 hours! Ugh! I'd rather watch paint dry than to have to endure 18 hours cooped up in a plane with no one to talk to. No wonder most business decisions are so cruel and heartless, if isolation like that is highly valued. Ugh!
Posts: 211 | From: California | Registered: Dec 2004
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The increasing anger of airline passengers is nothing new? I would take issue with that.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Geoff Mayo: And they wonder why people move to digital media.
Mr. Mayo, I wouldn't even know how to read a newspaper digitally. While of course, being a print subscriber, I have unlimited digital access to both The Times and Journal sites, the only use I make of such it to link material here and forward articles of interest to friends.
Digital forwarding certainly beats 'the old fashioned way' of clipping articles and mailing those clippings.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Henry Kisor: The increasing anger of airline passengers is nothing new? I would take issue with that.
You answered your own question there. Increasing, as in continuous, has been doing so for years. There is nothing new in that article that hasn't been written about by others.
quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman:
quote:Originally posted by Geoff Mayo: And they wonder why people move to digital media.
Mr. Mayo, I wouldn't even know how to read a newspaper digitally.
The words look and sound the same.
-------------------- Geoff M. Posts: 2426 | From: Apple Valley, CA | Registered: Sep 2000
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One thing about bringing back the "good old days" of flying that wasn't so good: SMOKING.
What was it, the last 12 rows or so on the big planes? I remember several flights from LAX to New York Kennedy on TWA when they were lighting up. The seats in coach were definitely larger than the sardine seating of today, but the air was really bad for the non-smokers.
Too bad USA didn't forge ahead with high speed rail, like some other countries did; now it might be too late for us due to cost, litigation, etc. Amtrak tries to do a good job, just on the slow side!
Posts: 588 | From: East San Diego County, CA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Possibly before your time, RRBob, but I can recall when an airline passenger could light up anywhere in the cabin - and if that wasn't enough, the airline would distribute complimentary three-packs of whatever 'pusher of the poison' was footing the bill.
Anytime, I watch TV shows like 'Mad Men' or 'Mob City', all I can think was the 'downside' - aka the foul fog. What youngsters have been spared from, remember there were those of us who suffered through headaches and smelly clothing.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Same for smoking on trains. Usually one coach was designated as a smoker, but that did not keep people from smoking elsewhere. (That was one of two, which was the norm for most trains when and where I was riding in the early 60's with the exception of such as the City of New Orleans.) Think of how common it was for people to light up after a meal in the diner.
Posts: 2808 | From: Olive Branch MS | Registered: Nov 2002
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I'm old enough to remember smoking on-board Amtrak. On a Superliner train! The divider used to be the stairway. I think it was in front of the stairways was smoking, behind it was non-smoking. There were lit signs on the wall at either end of the car that said "NO SMOKING" or "SMOKING", depending on how they had it set up. I used to HATE taking the Starlight to Seattle in coach with smokers. I did that trip so many times as a kid. I was very, very happy when they went to all non-smoking trains. It took a while, but they finally got there. I think the first step was: 1) No smoking in the diner, 2) No smoking in the diner and no smoking in coach (smoking only allowed in half of the upper level of the lounge, all of the lower level, nowhere in coach, and anywhere in your own sleeping accommodation), 3) Then it went to no smoking ANYWHERE on the train except the lower level of the lounge car. 4) Then it finally went to no smoking, anywhere, any time, PERIOD. Ahhhh....that's the best way to do it. But it was a gradual step-down. They did not do the whole kit and caboodle all at once.
Posts: 2355 | From: Pleasanton, CA | Registered: Apr 2007
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As Mr. Mayo likes to say, there's nothing new in that.
Posts: 2236 | From: Evanston, Ill. and Ontonagon, Mich. | Registered: Feb 2007
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(oh whoops, you could ride NY-LA on the Century and Super in the same Bedroom).
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Very interesting Gil. Amazing how all the news of the day fit into 15 minutes. And that included a fluff piece on the old automobiles.
The baseball athletes promoting the Camels seems really weird now. So does my memory of sitting in the back of the plane so I could smoke. Glad those days are gone.
-------------------- Vicki in usually sunny Southern California Posts: 951 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Aug 2006
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Not surprising Miss Vickie; in view of that NBC today gets the 'hard news' into the first twelve minutes of Nightly News. The remainder ten minutes (eight more are ads) is devoted to 'fluffy news' and 'features' like 'Making a Difference'.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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Overseas will just have to wait until the piggybank is overflowing enough for Business Class. ...
Mr Norman, transatlantic crossings on Cunard's Queen Mary 2 can be done for less than Business/Club air fares. I know you dislike cruising - as do I with the occasional exception of a Cunard ship - but the Queen Mary 2 is an ocean liner. Most of the aspects of cruising which we recoil from are absent except for the ubiquitous buffet, but attendance there is not mandatory. Classical musicians and abridged plays - even Shakespeare - are provided as an alternative to the usual ship-board entertainment. Basic staterooms are around $1600 pp one way (and inside rooms are cheaper); Princess Grill and Queen's Grill which provide very large rooms and single-seating dining run $3500 to $4500 and more for really large accommodations. If you don't mind flying into or out of Canada, Air Transat provides a modest Club section for $1400 to $1600 one-way, which is a lot more than it was last year when the seats were smaller, but much cheaper than the major airlines.
Posts: 216 | From: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 2000
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David, I certainly respect your thoughts as I do others such as Mr. Palmland who has echoed same, however any suggestion of ocean travel overlooks one factor - time away from home.
Although I am retired, and with no need to engage in any kind of post-retirement income producing activities, I really become 'yantzy' if I'm away from home much more than a week. I know quite a few here plan trips where they will be away for a month or more, but that is just not me. The longest I have been away since graduation has been three weeks - and that was over the 1981 'Holidays' when I had left the MILW and was about to start (bought out a retiring practitioner) my own CPA practice. Since then, I have never been away for more than ten days. During 2013, my travels were two four nighters, and four other 'one night stands', or a total of twelve nights. Two used round trip air, one of which included an auto rental; the other four were all private auto. Unfortunately, there was no Amtrak travel during the year (that be it assured, is not any kind of boycott whatsoever).
I have had two TRANSAT X-ings in this life during 1960. Eastward on the s/s Rotterdam (the one before the present day Love Tub), return on the s/s Constitution (possibly Mike's Father was a musician on that sailing). From a First Class perspective, both experiences were 'memorable'. Any of my six 'Love Tub' experiences during the '80's were all quite 'forgettable'.
Unlike a few here, and it appears a greater number at other sites, whom have expressed an aversion to air travel (is it some kind of being such a dyed in the wool railfan or other 'matter of principle' you refuse to do so?), I have no qualms whatever about boarding an aircraft. In fact, it can be enjoyable if there are good opportunities for flightseeing.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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return on the s/s Constitution (possibly Mike's Father was a musician on that sailing)
Gil, my dad sailed on the sister ship, the Independence, for American Export Lines, and it would have been mid-50's. Yes, he had a gig in the band one time.
-------------------- Ocala Mike Posts: 1530 | From: Ocala, FL | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:I have had two TRANSAT X-ings in this life during 1960. Eastward on the s/s Rotterdam (the one before the present day Love Tub), return on the s/s Constitution (possibly Mike's Father was a musician on that sailing). From a First Class perspective, both experiences were 'memorable'. Any of my six 'Love Tub' experiences during the '80's were all quite 'forgettable'.]
Mr. Norman--
I have not sailed on the current MS Rotterdam but have been on four other HAL ships and I wouldn't call any of them "Love Tubs". They are beautiful ships, conservatively decorated. Each has an extensive collection of onboard art ranging from Rembrandt to Andy Warhol. The service is "white glove" from highly trained mostly Indonesian and Philippino staff.
What cruise line were your other experiences on? If you mention Carnival I can understand.
While I think of it, Bon Voyage to Smitty. I think you are taking your "Cruise Virgin" trip soon.
Frank in sunny and warm SBA
Posts: 2160 | From: Santa Barbara, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 2003
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Frank; all were on HAL. Rotterdam, Statendam, Niew Amsterdam. I know some really like the experience, and I had a now deceased girlfriend who certainly did. But for me, it just isn't there.
I guess if I had no use for cruising on HAL, I shudder to think of what I would have thought had my experiences been with their 'Wally World' brand - Carnival.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Gilbert B Norman: ... Unlike a few here, and it appears a greater number at other sites, whom have expressed an aversion to air travel (is it some kind of being such a dyed in the wool railfan or other 'matter of principle' you refuse to do so?), I have no qualms whatever about boarding an aircraft. In fact, it can be enjoyable if there are good opportunities for flightseeing.
I have no aversion to air travel, per se, as long as I am seated forward of the curtain. Economy class travel for long distances is an abomination. It is a thoroughly dehumanising and miserable experience with long queues for checking in, then security,followed by horribly cramped seating for those of us who are taller than four-foot-six! An hour or two is tolerable - barely - but anything over that is something I can no longer endure. It was a horror when I was half my age or less, but as I approach my dotage it is impossible. To be sure Business/Club/Executive or whatever it is called is a different story, although jet lag is still unavoidable. The fares for this bit of luxury can be absurd. Fortunately we have Air Transat in Canada which has lower fares than the major airlines. I have used them for returning from England after our Atlantic crossings. But for our next eastbound crossing on Queen Mary 2 we have been given a deal for the return by the same ship at the same price we would have paid for Club Class - and that voyage is calling at Halifax en route to New York, so we can make arrangements to leave the ship at the former and take the "Ocean" and a corridor train to get home. I'm pleased to read that you enjoyed the previous Rotterdam. I made one trip on that vessel - it was indeed a lovely ship. If you ever decide you can stay away from home for a longer period, I'm sure you would enjoy a crossing on a Cunard ship. The Queen Mary 2 crossing can be called an "un-cruise".
Posts: 216 | From: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 2000
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Frank: Yes, I am!! I leave a week from Sunday for FLL on Virgin America, then board the ship on Monday (the 13th). I better start reading through my cruise stuff--I don't even know what time to get there! Ship leaves at 4PM.
Posts: 2355 | From: Pleasanton, CA | Registered: Apr 2007
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Smitty, I trust you are awares of the nautical 'lingo'; this coming from a one-time Fairfield Navy Cadet.
First, the ship SAILS at 4PM.
The vessel is a SHIP; it is not a BOAT - the latter is in what you leave the ship for a shore excursion, or heaven help, an emergency.
The very front is the BOW; the very rear is the STERN. If you are facing the same direction as the helmsman (the guy steering the thing; actually done by an automatic pilot) to the Left is PORT; to the Right is STARBOARD. If you're looking again in the same direction as the helmsman, you are looking FORWARD; if the opposite you are looking AFT.
You will be lodging in a STATEROOM; the floor of which and any other such on the vessel is a DECK. The area of the vessel above the Main Deck (OK these Love Tubs all have cutesie names for their Decks) is the SUPERSTRUCTURE; below is the HULL. To go on deck, you are TOPSIDE; otherwise you are DOWN BELOW.
Your ship's speed is measured in KNOTS; or about 1.15 statute miles. Moving forward is AHEAD; in reverse it is ASTERN.
OK; I'm tapped out; defer to our Love Tubbers around here for any additional.
Posts: 9975 | From: Clarendon Hills, IL USA (BNSF Chicago Sub MP 18.71) | Registered: Apr 2002
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