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i was wondering if u.p motive power ever ran with santa fe power? in all my photos of reference i have not seen these railroads run together. im sure they might have at one stage or another but some firm evidence on this would be greatly appreciated if anyone out there should know. thanks in advance
Posts: 17 | Registered: Sep 2002
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This is a tough one. Your question is complicated by the fact that both the Santa Fe and Union Pacific were competetors for lucrative LA-Chicago traffic and served many of the same destinations. I am willing to concede that the the two probably had some kind of pool agreement in which power was traded off to fulfill pool agreement obligations. This would have most likely been the most common types of locomotives in road service. This would have been early model GPs in the 1950s and 1960s, SD40-2s and U33Cs in the 1970s and 1980s, and Dash 8-40(B or C)s in the 90s. This is my educated guess on the subject and research on the topic might turn up a very different picture.
Posts: 315 | From: Lander,WY USA | Registered: Jan 2002
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thanks challenger. your thoughts are along the same line as what i was thinking. i agree that the railroads would pool power at one stage or another. i recall seeing a photo (b&w i think) showing u.p and s.p being serviced at the same engine terminal. but it was a 1st gen photo as had a lot of geeps and f's in view. ill keep looking thanx again.
Posts: 17 | Registered: Sep 2002
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I have see pictures with up locomotives leading a bnsf train with other bnsf locos behind it. hope this helps! Posts: 49 | From: Sarnia,Ontario,Canada | Registered: Mar 2003
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As a matter of fact, I see different combinations of road names all the time going thru K.C. I'm not sure I remeber ever seeing UP and BNSF together..or UP and SF (before the merger), but I have seen a lot of SP, NW, and some MP stuff leading UP trains. Also, I have seen several KCS units on either end of some shorter UP runs.
------------------ Cory (o:}=
Posts: 140 | From: Kirksville, Mo | Registered: Dec 2002
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I'm not sure if they shared pool power. I know there was no love lost between U.P. and Santa Fe. A few years before the merger the S.F. tracks were washed out by flood in the midwest, and S.F. had to send their trains on the U.P. right of way with U.P. pulling for them. The U.P. first decided that Santa Fe's two hot shot UPS trains were running too light for the power usage on the point so they put a bunch of loaded ballast hoppers on the trains to slow them down to 45 mph. Then they sent the San Francisco train to Los Angeles and the L.A. train to S.F. Since Santa Fe had "on time" delivery guarrantees with penalties, the U.P.'s games cost the S.F. a ton of money. A few years later, when the U.P. S.P. merger debacle took place, the U.P. had their entire system snarled up with nothing moving, and asked the S.F. to help out by moving some of their freight for them. The Santa Fe refused, and only relented when the government stepped in and ordered them to help.
Posts: 70 | From: Lakewood, California, U.S.A. | Registered: Mar 2003
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thanx everyone. i was sure that the 2 roads would have pooled power until russ proves that that theory could be wrong! any info is appreciated. interestind story though. thanx.
Posts: 17 | Registered: Sep 2002
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I saw one the other day.(within the last 8 months) I travel a lot so I cannot remember where, but it was a UP up front and a BNSF behind. I thought that it was weird, but they must of had some reason for it. It would have been in Nth Ca, OR or WA.
Posts: 17 | From: CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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I saw another one a few days ago. UP #1, BNSF #2, UP #3 & 4. It was going through Lincoln, CA towards Roseville, CA.
Posts: 17 | From: CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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I think that with power pools, the participating railroads may not have a lot of choice who they pool with. If they choose to join the pool, they are stuck with whatever they get. They can choose not to join the pool, but then they can't get pool power when they are power short.
Posts: 70 | From: Lakewood, California, U.S.A. | Registered: Mar 2003
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any info is appreciated. interestind story though. thanx.
