RAILforum: late c.z.

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Posted by irish1 (Member # 222) on :

we were traveling back from denver to milwaukee on july 29. we were suppose to depart denver at 750 pm. being an experienced train traveler i kept checking the trains status and knew it was running way late. the train finally arrived in denver about 245am to a round of cheers from all the people waiting. it did not leave until about 330 am. we were traveling with another couple and their two children. thats the real hard part is to have to wake up kids at 1am to go to the train depot. we ended up 10 1/2 hrs. late to chicago getting there at 230am instead of 4 pm. again having to wake up the kids at a bad time. we obviously missed our connnection to mke. amtrak did the best they could. they gave out free meals in the dining car even for the coach passengers. they boarded agents in mt. pleasant iowa to help all the passengers who were misconnets at chi. as for us they put us up in a hotel room in chi. they even covered a meal and cab fare to the hotel. i was very satisfied. ive been taking amtrak since the 70 s and i will take them again. but i felt bad that our freinds first experince had to be so bad. not sure if they will take the train again. i just wish there was a way that amtrak could improve their on time performance. i realize they are at the mercy of the freight railroads and all the other things that happen but most people dont and all theyn know is that their train was 10 hours late.

Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :

Someone I know who is a volunteer with Amtrak said they are forming a new committee to improve relations with the freight railroads.

It seems to me there should be a system of rewards and penalties to the freight railroads for on-time performance. If trains are on time, the freights should get a financial reward, but a penalty if trains are significantly late. The later the train, the higher the penalty. The more trains that are on time, the higher the reward. They may do some of that already.

I'm glad Amtak did everything they could. It was an awkward situation, certainly.

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Trust God, love your neighbor, and never mistake opinion for truth.
-Mr. Toy

The Del Monte Club Car

Posted by TALKrr (Member # 683) on :

I have said it a "thousand" times before (and I will say it again):

There is absolutely NO way for Amtrak (or any other PRIMARY passenger-rail server in this nation to "succeed" unless FREIGHT-RAIl fully "EMBRACES" it , and CHOOSES to "cooperate."

The ONLY way this will occur is if Congress grants freight-rail HUGE tax incentives and monetary incentives. Otherwise, any RELIABLE passenger-rail service in this nation is DOOMED ("double-DOOMED) to failure.

Money "talks." When the freight-rail companies realize that cooperating with Amtrak (or again, any primary passenger-rail server) will be "LUCRATIVE" to them, just wait and see how quickly the passenger-rail situation improves. But we are talking BIG money here---more money than the freight-rail companies ever even DREAMED of. Then, and only then, will there be a "difference."

Thus, Congress needs to make a "financial" offer that the freight-companies simply can NOT refuse.

Will Congress be willing to DO this ? We will soon find out, folks.

Posted by CK (Member # 589) on :

Wow! Right on the "Money" with your comments!

Posted by reggierail (Member # 26) on :

Just how much of the late trains are Amtraks fault? The freight handling takes way too much time. As was stated the train spent 45 minutes in Denver. It should have been in & out in 15. Change operating crews, water & fuel the train, work the baggage car & Hi-ball out of town. Why 45 minutes?
Reggie

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Posted by Konstantin (Member # 18) on :

I agree with the above comments. The freight
railroads need financial incentives to help keep Amtrak on time.

Reggierail, I understand your comments. I was on the Southwest Chief. We were already running a few hours late, and in Kansas City we switched mail and express cars for 2 hours and 20 minutes. I know that Amtrak is getting a lot of revenue from the mail and express business, but lately they seem to have put that ahead of the passengers in importance. If mail and express is more important than passengers, then there is no reason to keep Amtrak going. Just let the freight railroads handle the mail and express.

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Elias Valley Railroad (N-scale)
www.geocities.com/evrr

Posted by steve49 (Member # 941) on :

I was on the same train, we boarded in Emeryville on the 28th. The reason for the lateness was the loss of two of our three locomotives, one began overheating in Nevada and the next day we lost it for good and a second one to high crankcase pressure. We had to limp along thru Utah with 1 engine until we could tie onto a freight loco which was facing the wrong way and had no ditch lights on the rear. Most of the delays were caused by Amtrak equipment failure and it was actually U.P. who came to our rescue adding 2 more freight locos in Grand Junction. The on board crew did their best under the circumstances and Amtrak make good on their service guarantee, issuing a travel voucher for part of the fare.

Posted by steve49 (Member # 941) on :

Reggie: the delay in Denver was for the transfer of passengers. On our sleeping car alone there were 13 rooms changing hands in Denver. This meant that the car attendant had to clean the rooms and change the bedding before the new passengers could get on, because of the middle of the night arrival he could not start early because people were still sleeping.
Steve

Posted by MLC (Member # 58) on :

Konstantin said:

"I agree with the above comments. The freight
railroads need financial incentives to help keep Amtrak on time."

I believe there are incentives currently in place. I'm not sure whether they are positive or negative, however.

Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :

quote:
Originally posted by MLC:
I believe there are incentives currently in place. I'm not sure whether they are positive or negative, however.

The August issue of Western Rail Passenger review shows how much the freight railroads received in incentives (for on-time trains), or paid in penalties (for too many late trains):
CSX received $400,000 in incentives.
NS received $2 million in incentives
BNSF received $12 million in incentives
UP paid Amtrak $1.3 million in penalties.

This jibes with what I've heard from other sources. BNSF treats Amtrak trains very well while UP is the worst at keeping Amtrak on-time.

[This message has been edited by Mr. Toy (edited 08-25-2001).]

Posted by DC2001 (Member # 542) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Konstantin:
I was on the Southwest Chief. We were already running a few hours late, and in Kansas City we switched mail and express cars for 2 hours and 20 minutes.

Is this normal for the train in Kansas City? Shouldn't most of this switching be done ahead of the train's arrival? All the Chief should have to do is drop whatever express cars are K.C. bound, add a new cut of cars, make the brake test and get moving again. Roadrailers complicate things, but isn't there a switch engine around to switch the train? Shouldn't take more than 30 minutes (and it really shouldn't take that long) to make these moves. If work has to be done that takes longer, those cars could go on the Ann Rutledge (where they can be prepared before departure time).

Reasonable accomodation to handle mail/express is good for Amtrak and, by adding train & destination options, good for the passengers. But, unreasonable events like this tend to drive away those passengers.

Posted by Konstantin (Member # 18) on :

Mr. Toy:
Thank you for posting those numbers. Unfortunately, it is not enough. It appears to me that the incentives and penalties must be raised a lot.

DC2001:
I agree with you completely. I asked about other posibilities such as having a switch engine to do the switching, but no one seemed to have an answer. On our trip eastbound about two weeks before, we switched for a little over an hour and a half in that same spot. One of the things that most offended me was that they would not anounce what we were doing there. Even when we asked, there was not much of an explanation.

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Elias Valley Railroad (N-scale)
www.geocities.com/evrr