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Fox News has reported that the top nine airlines have again posted large losses for the quarter. Ridership and revenues are down. Are the airlines now in the same condition that the passenger railroads were in the '60s? At least three airlines have asked the government for loan guarantees. Will Bush-Mineta require the same from them as they require from Amtrak?
CK Member # 589
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The airlines will get whatever they ask for in terms of $$$$. Here's a clue, San Jose International airport is now named....."Mineta" International Airport. When a train station is renamed "Bush Union Station", Amtrak will begin making real progress.
Geoff Mayo Member # 153
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What I don't understand is how British Airways can lose more money while a budget airline, EasyJet, actually makes a big profit? I've never seen a low occupied BA jet, yet I've been on budget airlines charging $80 for an 800 mile roundtrip that are only 1/3 full 737s! And BA charge a fortune! Where does the money go?
To bring it back on topic, the rail companies in Britain are trying to raise fares... to keep people away.
Even more on topic, Amtrak is dirt cheap compared to the UK for train travel. Does Amtrak raise prices to get more money in and risk turning people away, or do they keep the fares low and possibly make (even more of a) loss?
Rant over.
Geoff M.
jimmymac Member # 1182
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I am not sure how Amtrak calculates the ticket prices, but I recently traveled from Charlotte, NC to Denver, CO in coach and that trip calculated out to 17 cents per mile. Compared to the airline fare it was about a hundred dollars cheaper.
Chip Member # 1733
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I think trains are pretty safe, plus you have more of a chance of survival if there's a wreck; airplanes you can go only one place; DOWN!
reggierail Member # 26
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That reminds me of a story I heard on my last train trip. While riding through a long flat stretch of track somewhere in the Heartland, the train I was on came to an slow and steady stop. After several minutes the conductor made an announcement over the PA. "Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen, this is your conductor. I'm afraid I have some bad news and some good news." "First the bad news, we have had a complete power failure in our engine, which is why we are now stopped."
"Now for the good news, you're on a train, not flying
MPALMER Member # 125
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The airlines will likely have an easier time getting access to taxpayer funds to help them through the current downturn. Airlines are an easier sell with Congress as I am sure most of the members fly routinely, and the airlines are very visible corporations.
Amtrak is more like Greyhound...members of Congress all know it is "out there" but they rarely use it except for the NEC.
As for low-cost vs. high-cost air carriers, EasyJet is probably a super-low-frills airline that pays its employees less and doesn't have all the "infrastructure" that BA has.
PullmanCo Member # 1138
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Remember, folks,
Transportation is an increasingly elastic economic sector. It's increasingly possible to replace business travel with electrons travelling along a digital band.
If you read the transportation reporters, you will see all kinds of issues in air pricing structures. The business traveller who is the bread and butter customer of the major systems sometimes gets treated less well (and pays for a bigger ticket) than the tourist.
At the same time, look at Southwest Airlines (NYSE: LUV). One airframe type ... so all the mechanical force is type certified. One class ... which saves fare structure management. Easy to use online ticketing. Courteous staff ... not Dilbert management. Super-premium mail and express operation ... what is under the passenger floor is as important as the passenger floor. Finally, respect for all the moving parts ... it takes a passenger (Customer), an Employee, and a Shareholder to make the airline work.
Southwest was profitable through the last airline downturn, and I have no doubt it will be this time.
As for as *ANY* Governmental airline (Swissair, Sabena, British Airways), you get the whims of Governmental philosophies and practices (Labour/Conservative debates) interfering in management policy (gee, does that sound like the NRPC?)
John
DISCLAIMER: I am a stockholder in Southwest Airlines. Do not take what I said as investment advice ... to paraphrase Dr McCoy ... I'm a datahead, not a stockbroker.
------------------ The City of Saint Louis (UP, 1967) is still my standard for passenger operations
Geoff Mayo Member # 153
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Fair point about budget airlines paying less, but the ironic thing is, economy Virgin/Continental/BA class is often worse than one-class EasyJet/Ryanair/Go. The latter three do also use just 737s. Even with these reasons, it still doesn't add up why there is such a huge gulf between the profits and losses of the aforementioned airlines.
By the way, BA was privatized at least a decade ago! I'm sure there are still some political influences in there - but how many big companies don't?
Geoff M.
Buslady Member # 1266
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Thats why I'd rather go on the rails than the air....may be a few hrs delay but at least I'm alive!
quote:Originally posted by reggierail: That reminds me of a story I heard on my last train trip. While riding through a long flat stretch of track somewhere in the Heartland, the train I was on came to an slow and steady stop. After several minutes the conductor made an announcement over the PA. "Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen, this is your conductor. I'm afraid I have some bad news and some good news." "First the bad news, we have had a complete power failure in our engine, which is why we are now stopped."
"Now for the good news, you're on a train, not flying
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