This is topic Old Timetables & Observations II in forum Amtrak at RAILforum.


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Posted by dnsommer (Member # 2825) on :
 
The May 19, 1974 Amtrak timetable is the first one I have showing Oakland-Fresno-Bakersfield service. There was one train a day in each direction. The trains, 710 & 711, begin their trips in mid-morning. Stations are Martinez, Stockton, Riverside, Merced, Fresno, Hanford, and Bakersfield. This train was called the San Joaquin. It had a diner, a lounge, and coaches.

Trains 793 and 794 cover the Seattle-Vancouver route. The train was called The Pacific International. It had a snack car, a dome car, and coaches. The southbound train leaves Vancouver CN Station at 6:15 A.M. and the northbound train leaves Seattle King Street at 6:15 P.M.

In this timetable it also appears Amtrak has adopted its own train numbering system. In the earliest timetables trains used the train numbers assigned by the railroad it operated over. There were duplicate train numbers. Train No. 1 was Amtrak's 8:00 A.M. service over the IC between Chicago-Central Station and New Orleans, LA. Train 1 also was Amtrak's 8:00 A.M. train over the GM&O between Chicago-Union Station and St. Louis, MO. And Train No. 1 was Amtrak's Sunset Limited from New Orleans, LA to Los Angeles over the SP.

In 1971, some Amtrak trains had what would seem like very peculiar numbers today. For example, there was Train 549-31-15, which operated between Washington, Pittsburgh, St. Louis, and Kansas City.

There also was Train 90-15-12-5-15, which was known as The South Wind. This train traveled between Chicago-Central Station to Orlando and both Miami and St. Petersburg.
The South Wind traveled over the Penn Central, The Louisville & Nashville, and The Seaboard Coast Line.

The May 15, 1975 Amtrak timetable has an attractive cover featuring an illustration by Gil Reid. The illustration shows two Northeast Corridor trains racing past the high level platforms of "Metro Park" Station in New Jersey (In Amtrak timetables Metropark is printed as one word). One of the trains is a Meroliner with cab car 829 in a red, white, and blue scheme. The other train is being led by electric loco 965. I believe this locomotive type was meant to replace Amtrak's aging fleet of GG-1s, but the design was flawed somehow and they didn't last long. Amtrak had better luck with the following type it acquired for the Corridor, which I believe is called a Pooch. It's a cover nice illustration.

This timetable is the first one I have that includes The Adirondack. It had a full service dining car and coaches during this period. Later, a dome car would be added, although I'm not sure when that was yet. The Adirondack would also be led for a time by famous Alco PAs in a D&H paint scheme, and these engines eventually ended up in Mexico where I saw trhem again years later in bad condition, if I'm not mistaken. I believe The Adirondack would also be covered with a Turboliner set for a time, too. But at its earliest days as an Amtrak train it had a full diner - and I don't think it has had any comparable food service since the diner was replaced.

The Spring, 1975 timetable also included an extended Empire State Express. The extension was from Buffalo across Ontario, Canada via Windsor into Detriot, MI. The US Customs stop was at Black Rock. I thought Black Rock was a tiny town in a bleak part of the Southwest, not a place near Buffalo. The Empire State Express extension also was intended to include stops at Welland and St. Thomas in Ontario at a date to be announced, but the entire extension itself was dropped with the issuance of the very next Amtrak timetable.

It's interesting to note that service between Buffalo, Cleveland, and Toledo was in the July, 1971 timetable as trains 68 & 69 (no name) but gone in the Spring, 1973 timetable. Service between these points would re-appear in Fall, 1975 as the "new" Lake Shore Limited.

Also new in the Spring, 1975 timetable was Amtrak's The Blue Water between Chicago and Port Huron, MI, and The Michigan Executive between Jackson and Detroit, MI. Passengers wanting to travel from Chicago to Toronto at the time had to either make their own arrangements to get from Detroit's Amtrak station to the Windsor, ON CN Station or spend a night in Detroit if they wanted to go the entire way by Amtrak. This timetable also indicates the introduction of Turboliners on the Chcago-Detroit route.

A big feature of this timetable was Amtrak's two thru NYC-Los Angeles sleeping car services. One route used The National Limited and The Southwest Limited via Pittsburgh, St. Louis and Kansas City. The other used the The Southern Crescent and The Sunset Limited via Atlanta, New Orleans, Houston, Tucson, and Phoenix. There is a very complex on the timetable's center pages map. The maps shows not only all long distance routes but the departure and arrival times at key cities too. It's called Amtrak's "Coast-to-Coast Service...at a Glance" I think this map appeared in this timetable alone.

Also new in this timetable was The Mountaineer from Norfolk, VA to Chicago via Cincinnati. The Mountaineer had a full diner, sleeping car, a dome coach and coaches. It combined with the Newport News/Washington sections of the James Whitcomb Riley at Concinnati. In earlier timetables Norfolk passengers for points west went by bus to Newport News, where they boarded the James Whitcomb Riley, a train that called at Richmond (Main Street Station) and then continued to Charlottesville where it merged with The George Washington from NYC and Washington. A bus connection operated by A.B.C. Bus Lines at Muncie, IN linked The Mountaineer's route with Indianapolis. Also of note is that Cincinnati Union Terminal was not open at the time. These trains stopped at Amtrak's Cincinnati - River Road Station.

Yet another new service in Spring, 1975 was The Arrowhead, a train that made the 144 mile trip nonstop between Minneapolis and Superior, WI. The Arrowhead had a snack car and coaches.

Canadian train services were given a full page in this timetable. There is no mention of VIA. CP schedules included were Montreal-Levis-Quebec City; Montreal-State of Maine-St. John; and Montreal/Toronto-Banff-Vancouver Lake Louise. CN schedules included were Montreal-Moncton-Halifax-St. John/Sydney; Montreal-Trois Rivieres-Quebec; Montreal-Ottawa; and Montreal/Toronto-Banff-Vancouver via Jasper. BCR one route between North Vancouver and Prince George is also shown. Regretably, many of these trains have stopped running. The BCR passenger train was anulled very recently.

Mexican trains are also shown. National Railways of Mexico services between Ciudad Juarez, Chihuahua and Mexcio City and between Nuevo Laredo, Monterrey, and Mexcio City are included. There werer two trains on both routes daily. Today, Mexico has very few passenger services, as many of you well know.

Many bus services are also included, including a bus between the Grand Canyon - Birght Angel Lodge and Phoenix a another bus between Flagstaff and Grand Canyon - Bright Angel Lodge. Nowadays you can get off Amtrak at Williams Jct., AZ and a ride a train up the canyon, which is in general against the overall diminishing scope of rail travel through the years.

Lastly, the Spring 1975 timetable provides names for two 'experimental' trains introdcued earlier: The Chicago-Seattle was named The North Coast Hiawatha, and the Washington-Cumberland, MD train was named The Blue Ridge.



 


Posted by MPALMER (Member # 125) on :
 
Lots of interesting history here!

I remember when the service was started between Oakland and Bakersfield. For much of its route it ran on Santa Fe rails, even though the SP had a more direct route through the large cities. Evidently SP was less willing to have another passenger train on its rails. Those old timetables still listed the "host rails" on the schedules, but I believe that info is no longer included in the current schedules.

I finally rode this train, as far north as Stockton, in the early 80s. Then, as now, there is a 2-hour bus trip between LA and Bakersfield. Railfans would like to see the return of an all-rail route, via Tehachapi, but I give that a -0- chance of happening. No "normal" passenger would ever travel such a roundabout route...

MP
 


Posted by espeefoamer (Member # 2815) on :
 
MPALMER:An overnight train would work as a through train LA to Oak.Most folks would rather catch a train leaving LA at 10:30PM than wait for a bus leaving at1:30AM.U.P.would never allow this though.They seem to be as anti passenger as S.P. used to be.
 
Posted by espeefoamer (Member # 2815) on :
 
MPALMER:An overnight train would work as a through train LA to Oak.Most folks would rather catch a train leaving LA at 10:30PM than wait for a bus leaving at1:30AM.U.P.would never allow this though.They seem to be as anti passenger as S.P. used to be.

------------------
Trust Jesus,Ride Amtrak.
 


Posted by dnsommer (Member # 2825) on :
 
I thought Amtrak has the right by mandate to operate whatever services it likes and whenever it likes too. I thought this was part of the deal as it pertains to taking the financial drain of providing interstate rail services off the railroad's backs.
 
Posted by dnsommer (Member # 2825) on :
 
How long would a train require to travel from LA to Bakersfield? How long would the overall travel time of LA-Bakersfield-Oakland compare with the travel time between LA and Oakland via the Coast Line? Is the Coast line still in danger of being abandoned by SP? It was going to be 20 years ago. Did the LA-Bakersfield line thru Tehachapi Loop ever have passenger service in its entire history? Have railfan excursions ever operated on it?
 
Posted by barrydraper (Member # 737) on :
 
dnsommer wrote:
"I thought Amtrak has the right by mandate to operate whatever services it likes and whenever it likes too."

Not any more. This was a provision of the original contract that most railroads signed, but it expired some years ago. Now Amtrak operates trains by mutual contract with the railroads, and each line can make whatever requirments it likes before allowing a new passenger train.

Barry Draper

 


Posted by dnsommer (Member # 2825) on :
 
Amtrak did have an overnight train called The Lark for a short time between LA and Oakland via the Coast Line. The SP operated a train named The Lark too on this route for many years before Amtrak, as is well known. I was living in Monterey when Amtrak tried resurrecting The Lark, and I remember discussing the new train with a very enthusiastic Amtrak ticket clerk at Salinas. I don't know why, but Amtrak's Lark wasn't a success if I'm not mistaken, and it was withdrawn after a brief period. It may have been that the consists were needed elsewhere too.

Dave
 




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