Here are 10 reasons why it is fun to ride Amtrak, these days: 1. It is fun to try and make telephone reservations on Amtrak's 800 number and get someone who can barely speak English. 2. It is fun to learn your round-trip from the bay area to Seattle, with delux bedroom accommodations, is over $ 1,000..you could fly round trip 2-3 times for that kind of money. 3. It's fun to hear, while in the Amtrak passenger depot, an overhead PA announcement so garbled you cannot make out a single word. 4. It's fun to get in some line, at the Amtrak depot, the purpose of which seems to be completely beyond all comprehension and beyond the understanding of even an Amtrak employee. 5. It's a fun surprise to see the Amtrak train is 2-3 hours late and that is normal. 6. While in the dining car, it's fun and most curious to see they ran out of hot water and that they are out of 2/3 of everything on the menu, even though the number of passengers has been known for 6 months. 7. If is great fun to be seated with a quarreling couple, in the dining car, who are completely drunk and shouting the "F" word at each other, which can be heard over the entire dining car. 8. It is fun to hear routine PA announcements, while on the train, which are completely incomprehensible. 9. Is is fun and quite curious to have your Amtrak attendant reprehend you because you told him you have baggage in both the upstairs bedroom and the downstairs luggage rack, but he didn't understand (probably because he can barely speak English). 10. It is fun and interesting to see your train is at least 2 yours late in getting to your destination, and that is normal. All the above have happend to me in recent years using Amtrak for vacation trips. Do I not make a case for the privatizing of our passenger rail system? RH (Grump) - San Jose, CA
Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :
excellent yukon, Especially the PA announcement thing at Union Station even!!
Anton
Posted by Sheriff (Member # 2521) on :
Yukon Sorry you had such a bad trip. Maybe you should write to Amtrak and explain to them about your misfortune.They have been known to give free rides to unsatisfied customers. If Amtrak owned their own railroad they would probably be on time every day. The problem is they do not own their own railroad (in most areas) but do lease the tracks from other railroad carriers for millions of dollars a year only to be heald back for one of their hot freight trains or behind a freight derailment. What little funding they receive from the US Goverment has to go towards the upkeep of the equiptment for your safty rather than buying new speakers for the depot. As far as privatizing Amtrak it has been tried and does not work. The railroads in Europe are subsidized by their Gov. with between 4 and 5 BILLION dollars a year and you can put the whole country inside the state of TEXAS. Our Lobbist for Amtrak fight like the devil just to get $750 million a year to help make repairs out of old scraped cars. Have you ever tried to take the 2 hour and 10 minute drive between San Jose and Sacramento in 5 o'clock traffic? It will take you about 4 hours if there are no wrecks. Again maybe your next trip will be a little more adventurious and pleasent. Amtrak might even through in one of those sleepers for free. You know you do get all your meals free and your own private room to actually lay down flat in. Cheer up Yukon. Look on the brite side. You could have been on the Big Gray *** who will take anyong on their buses and you could get to sit next to Stanley Stinky Feet.
Posted by Sheriff (Member # 2521) on :
sorry about the duplicate..........
[This message has been edited by Sheriff (edited 01-17-2004).]
Posted by CG96 (Member # 1408) on :
Yukon11, I'm also sorry to learn that you had a bad trip. However, when you compared prices for the sleeper, you also need to compare the price to the first class price aboard an airliner. Even then, it's still the apples vs oranges comparison. You can even make the reverse claim, that it is possible to find places where it is cheaper to go by rail than by air. Also, Amtrak doesn't just serve the big city pairs, but also the smaller cities in between. When you compare the prices of flying between, say, Fort Wayne, IN, and San Jose, Amtrak prices may look more competitve. I could also do the comparison between, say, Red Wing MN, and Winter Haven, FL. With the airlines, once you get away from the big city pairs, you'll notice that the rates jump considerably - not so with Amtrak. 2. As for the tardiness of the trains, those tracks are private property and not public in the same sense that the highways are. Amtrak depends upon the maintenance crews of the private railroads to perform upkeep. The private RRs also do all of their own traffic control, which is very different from the FAA-funded and operated system for the airlines. So, the private RRs can and do, give top priority to their frieghts over Amtrak. They are the property owners, so they can do that. If the signals on one stretch of track are malfunctioning, it is the responsibility of the RRs and not the local Highway Dept. to come and fix them. In some cases of inlclement weather, that is difficult. There are laws and contracts that say Amtrak sould have the same priority as the hoittest freights, but those are frequently unenforced. Being late is something that can occur when flying or driving as well - but I don't ever hear folks saying that they'll never fly again (sometimes I think the public may be more tolerant of the tardiness of aircraft and traffic jams). I have had experiences where flights have sat on the pavement for hours, and have sat in my share of traffic jams as well - so tardiness isn't just something that happens only to trains. Also, late trains are frequently not the fault of the service operator ( i.e., Amtrak, in this case). 3. As for privatization, the private RRs would run their own passenger trains if they thought it would make money. Amtrak was formed because the private RRs wanted out of that segment of the rail transport marketplace. The private RRs are also extremely reluctant to let Amtrak's right of access be given to anyone else. In other words, they aren't going to let Herzog run trains over their own tracks, and will fight like crazy to prevent that from happening. 4. As for the F-word, you can hear that in any airport that has to deal with bad weather or flight delays, or along tthe nation's highways as drivers deal with other drivers. Many of these criticisms could also be made regarding other forms of travel - this isn't something exclusive to Amtrak. Several of the issues that you list would be ameliorated if not resolved outright if Amtrak would be permitted some more funding. One has to spend money in order to make money, but Amtrak has never really been given a reasonable amount of money to spend in the first place. When one disinvests, one shouldn't be surprised when the disinvestment translates into a reduced or degraded level of service and availability. As the other poster noted, you could be riding the b-b-b-bus. If you think Amtrak was bad, try riding for 25 hours with several sick young people aboard
[This message has been edited by CG96 (edited 01-17-2004).]
[This message has been edited by CG96 (edited 01-17-2004).]
Posted by jefffromark (Member # 827) on :
It must be California problem if you cannot understand an Amtrak reservation agent of any employee for that matter. Each time I call Amtrak I get "Julie" which serves a good purpose. She is a bit slow but she speaks perfect english. Each time I'm connected to an agent I never had a problem either. You need to remember that at one time the railroads were privitized thats how we got Amtrak in the first place. I doubt it would change anything if it reverted back because freights will always get preference. Even on Amtraks's own rails there are delays and its just the same reason basically: poor management or lack of available equipment.
Posted by vincen47 (Member # 2201) on :
Your case is nonsense.
Private ownership in and of itself would have no bearing on any of your "It's fun" situations.
Simple fact: This poor service/communication/expense can occur regardless of the system's ownership. For example, do you believe that ticket prices would be cheaper with a private system?
Next time, fly if you think that is better for you. We have choices in transportation. That's the best part.
Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :
I retract my earlier comment, I didnt read all of them........ Just quit bad mouthing amtrak you jerk! If you want to fly then fly! You dont relize but haveing a sleeper is like a moving hotel with food! If you dont enjoy talking trains then don't! You dont have to share with a board of 100% RAILFANS! I do know what you mean though..Especially the drunk couple in the dining car you mentioned. I was in coach from Los angeles to San Jose, and I hated these 3 teenagers behind us! But sometimes you just have to look out the window and appreaciate AMtrak over a dumb plane that all you see is clouds and get awful food. ALSO, dont use 1800USARAIL for reservations!! "JULIE" is easy to use for me, but if you dont know her like me, just go to www.amtrak.com and you might even get a slightly lower fair.
Ride to Live, Live to ride AMtrak,
Anton
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
Yukon brings an interesting list of complaints. While I don't doubt their veracity, I don't think they are the norm, either. Most of us understand that Amtrak has its shortcomings, but we also know it is not a total disaster as some imply.
To address a few of Yukon's points: #1. I have only had a few occasions to talk to an Amtrak agent, but every time they have been professional and easy to understand. Only once did I encounter an agent with an accent, and it was a pretty mild one. On the other hand, whenever I try to get tech support for a software problem, I always get somebody like Yukon describes. And that is from an industry that is completely privatized.
#2. As CG96 points out, comparing a Deluxe sleeper to a coach air fare is hardly a fair comparison. You're comparing the most spacious accomodations to the least spacious seat on an airliner. It is like comparing the Monterey Marriott to a Motel 6, or a Cadillac to a Toyota Corolla.
I did a little comparison shopping for air and rail fares from San Jose to Seattle. For a randomly selected round-trip for two in mid March, a Superliner Standard bedroom would cost $579 (well under $1,000), or $289 per person. Flying coach would cost $204 per person. Cheaper, yes, but the train fare includes full meals and a Parlour Car with a full service bar, library, movie theater, and more.
But if you don't live in a major metropolitan area like San Jose, a Standard bedroom can be considerably cheaper than coach air fare. We live in Monterey, and often visit Salem, OR, which has no air service to speak of. The nearest airport is in Portland, about 60 miles away. We usually find that if we book at least two months ahead, we can take the train (Standard room for two) to Salem for about $100 less than flying coach from Monterey to Portland. The train gets us within five miles of our destination. So taking the train is indeed a practical and affordable alternative to flying in many markets.
#3. I'll agree, the PA systems in those old cavernous stations need improving.
#4. Why get into a line if you don't know what it is for?
#5. Unfortunately, rail traffic is controlled by freight railroads, not Amtrak. Privatization won't eliminate that problem. Improving track capacity to meet traffic demands would accomplish more.
#s 6 & 7. These are not a routine situations. Just bad luck. I've been in restaurants where similar things happened. Most of my Amtrak meals have been just fine all the way around. A few were less than perfect, but not really bad.
#8. I've never had a problem on Amtrak trains with bad P/A systems. One Caltrain trip had a horribly loud and distorted sound, though.
#9. I've never had an attendant who couldn't speak English fluently, either. Must have been an anomoly.
#10. Redundant (see #5).
Assuming all these things occurred at one time or another, does that automatically mean privatizing will solve them? Amtrak is a very large company. How many nationwide companies get their services right at every location every time? I've been to some chain stores that are friendly and produce a consistent product. I've been to others in the same chains where employees are sloppy and service is horrible. But even the best businesses make mistakes from time to time. The phenomenon of inconsistent service isn't unique to Amtrak. It is faced by most large organizations, public and private.
Privatization has its appeal, but as a practical matter complete privitization would require a major overhaul of the national railroad management structure. For privatization to be truly effective, you would need an open access system with competition among different lines. The American railroads are a closed system, with limited access rights. Only Amtrak has the guaranteed right to operate passenger trains on private railroad tracks, and the host railroads (private companies all) aim to keep it that way.
I'm not opposed to privatization per se. However, I have yet to see a privitization plan put forth in sufficient detail to convince me it will work any better than, or even as well as, what we have now. Until somebody does, there is no reason to think of it as a panacea.
[This message has been edited by Mr. Toy (edited 01-17-2004).]
Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :
Excellent put Mr. Toy!
LOL, Escalade to a COrolla
A.
Posted by espeefoamer (Member # 2815) on :
I have had very few bad trips on Amtrak.Most were in the very good to excellent range.I will definately ride Amtrak again!
