RAILforum: Amtrak Equipment Costs

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Posted by Robert L (Member # 3144) on :

I am interested in some cost figures on Amtrak equipment.
Specifically, the original cost, per unit or the package price on all cars ordered, on Viewliner sleeping cars and all the various Superliner II equipment and the auto-carriers on the Auto Train. Also, the current date cost of new orders in these catagories. Anyone have any information, or a close approximation for these costs?

Posted by Genesis803 (Member # 122) on :

According to "The Amtrak Story" by Frank Wilner, the original prices are as follows:

E60CP electrics:1973-$692,000 each-26 units
SDP40F Diesels: 1973-$453,000 each-150 units
P30CH diesels: 1974-$480,000 each-25 units
F40PH diesels: 1976-$413,000 each-200+ units
AEM-7 electrics:1976-$2.9 mil. each-54 units
AMD-103 "Genesis":1993-$2.3 mil each-52 units

Amfleet I: 1973-$541,000 each-492 cars
Amfleet II: 1980-$766,000 each-150 cars
Superliner I: 1979-$848,000 each-284 cars
Horizon: 1989-$1 mil each-104 cars
Superliner II: 1994-$2.4 mil each-195 cars
Viewliners: 1994-$1 mil. each-50 cars

Don't know how accurate these figures are. The book was published in 1994 so it doesn't include info for the P42 diesels, Talgo, and Acela, nor does it say much about the California Cars.

I know the Superliner II's have more "technology" than the Superliner I's but it is amazing how much the price went up between 1979 and 1994.

If you haven't read "The Amtrak Story" it is a great book. Hope this helps!!!

Posted by TheBriz09 (Member # 3166) on :

The Amtrak Story IS a great book. I used it for a research paper on the history of Amtrak.

Anyway, according to an article of Trains magazine (Oct. 2002, page 33) the author pegs the cost of P42 locomotives at "about $2 million each", although I suspect that the figure is closer to the $2.3 million that Genesis indicated for the AMD-103s.

The author also says that an Acela Express trainset costs $35 million.

I am surprised that the Viewliners cost less than half of Superliner IIs. I know they are smaller but they contain much of the same technology as the Superliner IIs, including more advanced stuff like those nifty LCD TVs. Just a comment.

[This message has been edited by TheBriz09 (edited 04-08-2004).]

Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :

WOW--Those numbers are very intereasting!
Thanks Genesis803!

Who makes Superliners/Viewliners?
------------------
--Anton L.
pillsbury09@excite.com
AIM: pillsburyMN

[This message has been edited by CoastStarlight99 (edited 04-08-2004).]

Posted by panamaclipper (Member # 3058) on :

The late 70s and early 80s were the period of highest inflation in this country. That's part of the reason the SL numbers jump so.

Posted by Genesis803 (Member # 122) on :

I too have used the book to write research papers in high school and college.

Accoring to the book, Amfleet I's and II's were made by the Budd Company. Horizon, Superliner II's, California Cars, and Acela Express were all made by Bombardier. Bombardier's website has specifications on Superliner II's and Acela Express.

Viewliners were designed by Amtrak way back in 1983 using body shells from the defunct Budd Company. Two prototype sleepers and one diner were built at a cost of $4 million each. Amtrak had first proposed acquisition of 222 Viewliners but could only afford 50 sleepers 9 years later in 1992. Those Viewliners were built by Morrison-Knudsen of Boise, Idaho which then filled bankruptsy.

Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Genesis803:

Superliner I: 1979-$848,000 each-284 cars
Superliner II: 1994-$2.4 mil each-195 cars
I know the Superliner II's have more "technology" than the Superliner I's but it is amazing how much the price went up between 1979 and 1994.

I just went to an inflation calculator, and in constant dollars the Superliner 1s were a much better buy. In 1994 dollars the Superliner 1 price would be just over $1.5 million per car.

The inflation calculator is on this page, about a quarter of the way down there is a link: http://www.bls.gov/cpi/home.htm

------------------
Sing to the tune of Humoresque:
Passengers will please refrain,
From flushing toilets while the train,
Is standing in the station,
I love you.

The Del Monte Club Car

Posted by JONATHON (Member # 2899) on :

"F40PH diesels: 1976-$413,000 each-200+ units"

Only That much for 200 units?
but its $2 & a half mill for a single Pacific Surfliner Coach

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JONATHON D. ORTIZ

Posted by George Harris (Member # 2077) on :

The comparison that knocks my socks off is:

F40PH diesels: 1976-$413,000 each-200+ units
AEM-7 electrics:1976-$2.9 mil. each-54 units

Or pick any other diesel. This says you could buy 6 diesels for the cost of one electric!!!!!

Unless there is something seriously wrong with one of these numbers, economics says tear down all the overhead. But, there has got to be something wrong with this picture somehow. After all, all a diesel is is an electric locomotive that is carrying its own generating plant around with it.

(Yes, I know the AEM-7's were supposed to be high speed low axle load engines for northeast corridor service, but again, how much does it cost to have a truck that tracks well at high speeds? If you take the average B-B diesel, remove the diesel and add a pantograph, you get a low axle weight electric locomotive.)

Can somebody shed some light here??

Posted by Southwest Chief (Member # 1227) on :

The amount of a Superliner I is a bit off, as the Diners cost 1 million each. The Sleepers were also a bit more than $848,000, probably close to a million. Can't remember where I read this but I believe it was from an old Passenger Train Journal.

But 2.4 million is still a lot more. Wonder how much it cost Bombardier to get the Pullman Standard plans and rights to those plans (looks like Amtrak bore the brunt of these costs)

Also the reason a Superliner is so much more than a Viewliner is simply the size. Superliners are huge and when you get to these sizes everything has to be bigger and stronger, adding to the costs all the while.

When the Santa Fe ordered thier Hi-Levels from Bud, they were very expensive compared to conventional single level railcars. However the economies that were realized by allowing for 11 car trains versus 14 car trains while carying more passengers imediately added up and this is why Amtrak purchase more costly double decker cars for thier long distance western trains. You end up paying more at the begining, but the operational savings average out in the end.

[This message has been edited by Southwest Chief (edited 04-12-2004).]