How about if Amtrak created a new sleeper car with bigger accomadations. This would take care of the big families (of which many have posted here lately). Plus, they could add some features that would allow for a higher ticket price. If you took a sleeper and took out the standard rooms, and just had large deluxe type room that could sleep, 5-6 with their own bathroom. Also include things like a TV and DVD/VCR capabilities. Maybe a working radio that you could tune into stations as you travel. Both of these would be low cost features that would be nice additions. I think you could easily charge more for these rooms. Plus the extra room would generate a higher ticket price AND it would bring in families AND make the trip a bit nicer.

I guess it's the old "it takes money to make money" idea, but without funding I don't see how Amtrak can really do much to improve their accomodations and equipment in the ways you suggest.

Just my thoughts.

Bigger bedrooms are not going to save Amtrak. The trains are already running near capacity and if they getting any more popular, Amtrak will have a huge problem.

Big Merl, I think you have a good idea about fully reclined seating and I'm curious to know if you are aware of anybody out there that has actually pulled this off (except Virgin Airlines).

Fully reclined seating, or at least more ergonomic seating (like those found on the Surfliner) might enhance Amtrak's appeal to the masses.

In the past I have asked the board whether Sleeper cars were a financial burdon to Amtrak's bottom line, but got no response. Having just bought into my first long-distance sleeper, my initial impression is that they look pretty pricey to maintain.

I wonder if there might not be some sort of economically viable middle road between sleepers and coach.

In planning our trips, dh wants to fly because he's concerned about spending two days straight on the train, especially with our brood, even with a sleeper.

However, he'd like to fly to Portland, or San Francisco and take the one of the coastal trains to LA. But not knowing what to expect by way of a connection from airline to train is enough fo us to resign to flying.

I'm a genealogist. In my world of genealogy, any of us who want to get information online has to fork out $200 per year in subscription to get most information from the web.

However, a national community of genealogist have set up a very extensive information network for each state, county, and city, where volunteers maintain a web site for each locality with information on local libraries, where to get vital records, and donated records. The volunteer effort has helped us beat the system.

Maybe we could help Amtrak, and I know some already have, this site being the proof, by setting up "official" insider web sites for each station.

If I could find a safe and economical way to transfer my family from the airport in any of the following cities, KC, Denver, Salt Lake, Reno, Oakland, LA, Albuquerque, Fullerton, Portland, Seattle, my dh would consider taking a portion of our trip on the train each way.

Speaking for families, we want to know how to get to the nearest hotel at midnight after we just got off the train. We want to know if the city we will be dropped off is a walking city, like Chicago, or watch- your-back-city like KC. We want to know if we need to pack a snack on the way because, like Omaha, there are only expensive yuppy restaurants nearby, or if we can rely on McDonald's when we get there. Is there a museum at the station like KC and Omaha? Is the station big, seating comfortable, or is the station open for just minutes a day with car being left to the mercy of whoever walks by while you are gone. If so, is their a parking structure within walking distance? I know some have maintained web sites with some of this information, but information would best service us if it was linked to one major Internet hub, like USGENWEB.ORG, where you can go to a national site and click on links to individual stations.

It seems to me, Amtrak is so stretched they don't even have time to be an information bureau. The information they provide on their web site, while contains a lot of information, is quite scanty when it comes to the particulars we need to feel brave enough to go on the train. We need more how-to's

Contrast that with the airlines....yesterday I was able to find at the Omaha airport, where the parking was located, the parking charge, the shuttles that service the airport, the airlines that service, the weather, restaurants in the airport, points of interest nearby, and hotels.

Well, at least it would be a inexpensive enhancement that couldn't hurt. Especially, if it were a community effort run by Amtrak fans.

I'm definitely not an expert on train riding. Never been on one, but I certainly know what the hurdles are from keeping me from taking my first train ride.

And as always, I know I'm ignorant, so if this is just a bunch of "hot air" have a good laugh and take it with a grain of salt.

Thanks,

There was only one successful economy sleeper out there and that was the Budd Slumbercoach which Amtrak eventually acquired the entire fleet of those built new during the "mid-fifties' as well as many ex NYC "conversions".

The only reason the Slumbercoach was a success, both with public acceptance and with operational economies was that it represented a breakthrough in Sleeper capacity. The ubiquitous 10-6 slept 22; the 24-8 Slumbercoach 40.

I think two things doomed the Slumbercoach on Amtrak. First was the oft reported need to convert all cars to retention toilets; the myriad of plumbing arising from the duplex arrangement would have made such economically unfeasable.

A second reason was Amtrak's ability to implement demand pricing resulting constantly changing accomodation charges to reflect anticipated demand on any train. Railroads were regulated; this is the price we charge - period. Even if we wanted to change it, we would have to jump through regulatory 'hoops' to do so. Amtrak was deregulated on A-Day, but the perfection of information systems, even on airlines, was hardly in place.

Amtrak can simply accomplish the same purpose using its existing configurations for the present and hopefully some day expanded fleet and offer reduced rate sleeper accomodations away from the peak travel periods.

I couldn't find any layouts of the slumbercoach, but I did find a nice shot of the exterior:
http://home.att.net/~jtbradley/amtk2021.html

I don't understand why they need elaborate plumbing for a crapper. It just breaks down in the end. Thanks for insight into a bygone era.

Debbie,

I had a memorable experience with a Morman during the New Mexico State Fair. She logged on to Ancestry.com and located the handwritten 1930's census report for father's family. It sent shivers up and down my spine. The extraordinary thing was that she found it, even though the census taker had misspelled our last name. You guys are good.

I recommend stopping in Albuquerque for your train adventure. The station is now located in the old gift shop of the Alvarado Hotel, which was torn down in the 70's. It's a crumby station, but its better than nothing, I suppose.

A couple blocks away is the La Posada Hotel, the first hotel built by Conrad Hilton. It has a lot of Old World charm and the elevators move at a nice clip. It has a nicely restored lobby and I think you will find the rates affordable. East of La Posada is a place called Maisel's where you can buy Indian pots for a fraction of the price you would pay elsewhere. Some of it is quite good.

La Posada has a van that can transport your brood from the station to the Hotel and from the Hotel to our International Airport.

Albuquerque is probably as safe as anywhere, I would think. I have lived here (in the Old Town area) for over 20 years and I've never had any trouble. But then, I don't go looking for trouble, either.

You can take a restored trolley from the ATC (Albuquerque Transit Center) to Old Town where your kids can frolic at the Children's Museum. Then you can check out the Natural History Museum as well as our beautiful crown jewel, the Albuquerque Museum.

A little ways up Central ave from Old Highway 66 is our aquarium and botanical gardens, also worth seeing.

I suppose I should give a plug for the Atomic Museum in Old Town as well, but I'm really quite pissed at them for erecting a 60 foot missile in front of their digs. It's not the missile concept that bugs me, I would have objected to a 60 foot dinosaur as well. Fact of the matter is, it just doesn't fit.

Thanks Chucky,

quote:

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Originally posted by iowamomofsix:
Well, at least it would be a inexpensive enhancement that couldn't hurt. Especially, if it were a community effort run by Amtrak fans.

I'm definitely not an expert on train riding. Never been on one, but I certainly know what the hurdles are from keeping me from taking my first train ride.

And as always, I know I'm ignorant, so if this is just a bunch of "hot air" have a good laugh and take it with a grain of salt.

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What Debbie said above sparked my interest, and I think it's quite the idea, if there's enough support to get it going. Why couldn't we get a volunteer website going with details like Debbie described? It would be a mammoth coordinating effort, but I think there are enough people on this board with the web know-how to do the coding and such (I could start), and I have no doubt that if everyone here contributed information, we could easily get pages going for all of the major stations and many other ones besides. It's a big dream, sure, but like Debbie says, it would begin to fill a big hole.

What's stopping us?

I think this idea at least warrants further conversation, if nothing else... if Debbie or anyone else wants to chat about the possibilities, definitely drop me a line at David-Breisch@augustana.edu. Or if anyone uses AOL Instant Messenger, my screenname is TheBriz09. I would love to hear from you.

quote:

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Originally posted by iowamomofsix:
However, he'd like to fly to Portland, or San Francisco and take the one of the coastal trains to LA. But not knowing what to expect by way of a connection from airline to train is enough fo us to resign to flying.

If I could find a safe and economical way to transfer my family from the airport in any of the following cities, KC, Denver, Salt Lake, Reno, Oakland, LA, Albuquerque, Fullerton, Portland, Seattle, my dh would consider taking a portion of our trip on the train each way

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Hey Debbie,

Here are some tips that I can offer from past trips and or research for getting from Airports to Rail Stations.

In San Francisco you can take BART. One or two stations from the airport there is a BART station and transfer point to the CalTran Commuter trains. Take the Commuter train south to San Jose and you can interface with the Amtrak system there.

In Portland the Max lightrail operates from the airport into downtown coming within just three blocks or so of the train station.

In St. Louis the light rail goes from the airport to Union Station which, sadly, is a four block dusty hike to where the Amtrak station is actually located.

If you go east, the BWI airport has direct light rail service to Penn Station in downtown Baltimore or a free shuttle bus to the BWI Rail Station.

In June 2002, fearing an imminent Amtrak shutdown, I made a trip to sample as many of the Amtrak routes that I don't have much of an opportunity to ride. As part of that trip I arrived via Amtrak in Albuquerque from Los Angeles (in coach Chucky!!!) and caught the city bus right next door to the airport. There was (and I assume still is) a route that got me right to the airport without having to change for just $1.00.......and the airport in Albuquerque is very close to downtown......maybe just three or four miles out.....unlike Denver or Kansas City. As Chucky will tell you, Albuquerque has some real advantages.

Denver does have bus service called SkyRide offered by the RTD. Takes 45 minutes or so and costs $8.00 per person one-way. Not cheap with a big family. The SkyRide bus gets you to the downtown transfer terminal on 16th street just a few blocks from Union Station. You can get the free downtown shuttle bus to the foot of 16th street which is only a block or so from Union Station.

Best wishes and Happy Travels.

My brother-in-law is coming to visit me in Albuquerque and I can't get him to stay at the La Posada. Instead I fixed him up at an interesting place on a hill called Plaza Inn.

Although it is not in the middle of downtown, it is in a very lovely place, on a hill overlooking the city: http://www.plazainnabq.com/location.htm

The Plaza Inn appears to have a van driver that will not only take you to train/plane, but evidentally it will also drop you off in Old Town or Downtown. From there you can connect with public transit and get to wherever you like. There is actually a bus (the #11) that could conceivably drop you off within a block of your motel.

As far as the distance from downtown to the airport is concerned, I would say it is a good 10 or 15 miles. Certainly not a hop, skip or a jump. But easy by motorized vehicle, ever since we rebuilt our freeways.

quote:

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Originally posted by Chucky:
from downtown to the airport is concerned, I would say it is a good 10 or 15 miles. Certainly not a hop, skip or a jump. But easy by motorized vehicle, ever since we rebuilt our freeways.

(edited 02-09-2005).]

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Gee.......it seemed only half that distance at most. I guess I was just having such a pleasant ride on the Albuquerque bus.....clean, quiet, pleasant. And the Albuquerque Airport is one of the nicer airports I have been in too.

The train is almost always on time or early at ABQ, due to padding. It is a beautiful, small and safe downtown with many attractions, and centrally located in a scenic state. Beautiful and easily accessable airport terminal too, easy to drive in and out of with no traffic.

I love your idea about all of us contributing to a website of Amtrak info! Having tried many stations west of CHI, and living in St. Paul near the depot, I could contribute much.

[This message has been edited by TwinStarRocket (edited 02-09-2005).]

As I said, this is off-topic, but your mention of the GenWeb sites inspired me to comment!! Good luck in your geneaology pursuits!! And I, like many others on this forum, DO hope that you and your big family will attempt another train trip in the near future!! Your kids will love it!!!

Thanks for the ABQ information. I would love to take the SWC to ABQ and fly the rest of the way.

RRRICH, are your guides online? I'd love to read them. I've become addicted to the Amtrack web site because I love geography and love maps. I like to look up station addresses, put them in Yahoo maps, and then look at the Smartfinder to see what is surrounding the station. However, without having been to these places myself, it's still hard to get an accurate picture of the environment around each station. I love reading the travel reports that are up on the web, and looking at photos.

David, I'd be willing to feature a page on the Omaha station, if a volunteer group like USGENWEB could be started. I wouldn't know how to link the site all together, but I do know how to code a page. Or, one of my kids could do it. We go to Omaha about once a month and I could start doing some research, even though I haven't been to the station yet. However, I am getting a pretty good grasp of the area.

Another question to the whole group, why don't I hear Amtrak commercials anymore, you know, "America is getting into training, training the Amtrak way." Have I had my head in the sand, or has Amtrak given up on ad campaigns? And if so, why?

Everyone have a great day,

The link starts at Omaha. The website contains pictures, station code, address, trains that use the station, and distance between them.

I was thinking about it today, and I think that maybe soon I will put up a poll asking people what they think about the idea and whether they would be willing to contribute... and perhaps if I get some time then I could work on putting together some concept pages.

You're right. That's what I'm looking for. The web site was fun to look at, however, and the pictures were worth a 1000 words. It was fun to see some old haunts in California, like the Riverside station where we used to eat at the Spaghetti Factory, Y Mount in Provo, UT.

Thank you!

Debbie