The people could be bus to Lafayette, put on Amtrak to Houston. Instead of running buses back and forth between New Orleans and Houston.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
OK, and I guess the cruiselines could have put- putted up to New Orleans whatever love tubs are presently on the Caribbean circuit and made them "floatels' for the duration.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
1 Train can carry more than 1 bus.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
I may have spoke to soon.
Amtrak lines could be used to evacuate NO residents
By Sylvain Metz smetz@clarionledger.com
MERIDIAN — An evacuation plan via Amtrak train for New Orleans residents trapped by Hurricane Katrina's devastation and floodwaters is being worked out by Amtrak president David Gunn, Meridian Mayor John Robert Smith said today.
The proposition of using cruise ships as floating hotels actually came up on another chat board called Cruise Talk but since cruise ships are foreign flagged would probably not be a viable solution. And since there are 25,000+ refugees it would take 8-10 cruise ships to do this. NO cruise line is going to be willing to give up that for 12-16 weeks.
It is a much better idea to bus them, 'non stop', from NOL-HOU without having to get on a bus, then get off the bus onto a train, then back off the train in Houston back onto a bus for the final leg from the train station to the Astrodome. This would be a logistical nightmare.
The City of Houston and the Red Cross has already set in motion accomodations and services for these 25,000 refugees at the Astrodome.
Amtrak proposed using the 'Crescent' line to evacuate them to areas along that route towards B'ham and Atlanta, but where would you accomodate 10,000+ refugees if they went that way? Not a good idea.
Better to keep them all 'together', for Red Cross purposes, in the Astrodome and use buses to get them there asap. The buses are already lining up.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
They won't need to get on another bus in Houston. They could take the light rail to the Astro-dome. Also is there not at UP line a few blocks from the Astrodome?
I-10 between Beaumont and Orange is being rebuilt. I-10 and loop 610 east is being rebuilt in Houston. Those Buses will have a nightmare trip.
Posted by Capltd29 (Member # 3292) on :
I think they said they needed 400 some busses, will that fit on a light rail train?
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
Once the buses depart New Orleans for Houston with the 'refugees' I dont believe it makes any logistical sense to travel one-third or halfway from New Orleans to Houston to detour off the interstate and delay their arrival by having them, by the thousands, get off the buses then transfer them over to a train. This type of transfer could delay their arrival by many hours.
And the fact too, that every time you had 4 or 5 buses show up you would have to have ANOTHER train ready to depart. This also would be totally impractical. How many trains would you need? Ten, twenty, going roundtrip? And the trains going back eastbound to pick up more passengers would be empty. And does Beaumont or Lafayette have the facilities to turn trains around and stage holding facilites for thousands upon ten-thousands of people?
And for them to arrive in Houston at the very front door of the Astrodome via bus is a much better option than having thousands upons ten-thousands transfer from bus, to train, to lightrail (or walk blocks from any depot. It is imperative for the Red Cross to keep track of these refugees so that in case loved ones are trying to get ahold of them they can be accounted for. Letting them loose in Houston to walk blocks to the Astrodome (or multiple transportation transfers) only invites the opportunity for some of them to 'disappear' into the Houston/Lafayette/Beaumont population. Houston is going to have a hard enough time adding this unprecedented number to its population (now being estimated at over 35-40,000), feeding them, adding them to their school and medical rosters, and letting them contact next of kin.
Using a bus, door-to-door, is the only logical way to transfer 35,000-40,000 people.
FEMA has already allocated nearly 250 buses to accomodate this transfer with more on the way.
The Mayor of NOL and Governor of LA had now indicated that New Orleans must be completely evacuated of ALL people. Every last soul must be evacuated. NO one is to be left behind in a city, that for all accounts and purposes, is dead. It will take 12-16 weeks to pump out the water and restore electricity, water, and clean this TOXIC mess up. This is going to be a stagerring relocation and clean up effort like our country has never seen before. And thats alot of people who we dont want to get 'lost' in the system.
Once the city is brought back 'online' and has been deemed 'habitable', THEN they can take trains, Superliners by the hundreds, NONSTOP back home, and AMTRAK can step in and be a hero.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
Oh, and another thing, when most of these refugees DO get to return in 3-4 months, they will find out that their homes and business will need to be destroyed, raized to the ground, due to toxic contamination. This is going to be heartbreaking...
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
The drive between Houston and New Orleans is 7 hours;normal drive. Today I would guess it is 10-12 hours because buses leaving NOL will need to travel north to central louisianna before turning west. That is a round trip of 24 hours. Since each of the buses will need to make many trips. People will be stuck in NOL for buses to return. Much easier to use the coach and lounge of all the SL trains. Buses go to Lafayette Cajundome until able to catch a train to Houston. Cajundome or any place outside NOL is better than waiting in NOL.
Posted by JONATHON (Member # 2899) on :
quote:Originally posted by gp35: I may have spoke to soon.
Amtrak lines could be used to evacuate NO residents
By Sylvain Metz smetz@clarionledger.com
MERIDIAN — An evacuation plan via Amtrak train for New Orleans residents trapped by Hurricane Katrina's devastation and floodwaters is being worked out by Amtrak president David Gunn, Meridian Mayor John Robert Smith said today.
Go Amtrak!
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
I guess what it boils down to is that the American Red Cross and the Federal Emergency Managment Agency (FEMA), the two main agencies coordinating the relocation of the refugees from New Orleans to Houston do not apparently agree with your synopsis, as the first few dozen of what will be 300+ buses have ALREADY left the Superdome for Houston.
Amtrak is NOT an option at this point in time...QUOTE:
"Amtrak spokesmen said Wednesday there is no formal plan to use its trains to evacuate Katrina's victims from New Orleans".
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
Ok, we will see how well their plan works. My plan gets everyone out of NOL in about 36 hours.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
In 36 hours they will STILL be pulling people out of buildings, hotels, and off of highway overpasses.
In SEVENTY-TWO hours there will STILL be TENS of thousands of people stuck in their houses, apartments, hospitals, elderly care facilites, and university dorms that they dont even know about YET. Watch MSNBC, CNN, and Fox for a while like I have (12-15 hours a day for 3 days straight) and you will see the staggering numbers of people still stuck and trapped!
MSNBC, FEMA, and the American Red Cross estimates that there are over 100,000 people still in New Orleans.
One-hundred-thousand-people!
It will take a WEEK to evacuate everyone from the city.
AND whenever Amtrak decides to get a thought together to maybe plan a possible way to maybe get some people out, FEMA (again the agency running the show) has NOW acquired 475 buses to move refugees out and the buses are already rolling.
By time Amtrak develops a plan of attack, it will be too late. But thats the Amtrak MOTTO isnt it, better late than never?
:-)
Posted by SilverStar092 (Member # 2652) on :
I agree that this is one case where busses are more practical. Superliner coaches can hold only about 80 people. If you somehow crammed 100 people per car, a train of 20 coaches would only be able to carry 2000 people. Even if Amtrak had 20 spare coaches, it would take days to position them in the right place as many would have to travel NOL-SAS-Lafayette. Indeed making a bus-train-bus trip would be a nightmare and would dump many folks on the doorstep of intermediate towns. The newspaper article cited the possiblity of travel toward Atlanta which is impossible. The NS bridge over the lake is washed out and there are hundreds of trees down along the right of way. See Trains online for details.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
quote:Originally posted by SilverStar092: I agree that this is one case where busses are more practical. Even if Amtrak had 20 spare coaches, it would take days to position them in the right place as many would have to travel NOL-SAS-Lafayette. Indeed making a bus-train-bus trip would be a nightmare and would dump many folks on the doorstep of intermediate towns.
I thought I was going to go CRAZY trying to make my point. THANKS for making me sane again...
:-)
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
UPDATE:
At 11pm CST (Wednesday night) the first of a legion of buses with refugees from the Superdome in New Orleans have reached the Astrodome in Houston!
UPDATE:
As of 10am EST Thursday over 60 buses have now arrived at the Astrodome with refugees, but there are still tens-of-thousands left to go...:-(
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
San Antonio now has agreed to take in up to 25,000 refugees to be housed at the Alamodome. Thats almost the size of my whole town!
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
We have 10,000 and they are talking about adding more by opening up an abandom 300 bed hospital. The media is only covering Houston and Baton Rouge, everyone else effort don't count.
Today they finish registering the kids in school. Texas has cleared them to play high school football. The Texas workforce center are finding them jobs. Some are saying they aren't going back. I guess it's nothing to go back too.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
The yellow school buses start rolling early tomorrow morning. The shelter kids first day at a new school in a new state.
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
quote:Originally posted by dmwnc1959: San Antonio now has agreed to take in up to 25,000 refugees to be housed at the Alamodome. Thats almost the size of my whole town!
That's 7,000 people more than live in my entire county.
That's nearly 1,000 people more than a sellout crowd to watch Kentucky play basketball in Rupp Arena.
While the alamodome isn't home, the lights work, there isn't three feet of water on the ground, and the air-conditioning is supurb.
Posted by SilverStar092 (Member # 2652) on :
A Louisiana official said on TV tonight that trains will soon be used for the evcuation. Is GP35 that official? I still wonder where the equipment would come from unless commuter lines like METRA are sending cars southward. Any way you cut it, it takes too long to round up rail equipment and position it where it is needed for this to be of much immediate help. I am assuming they are not talking about putting people in freight cars. I don't want to mention what historical event that brings to mind.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
When I say something, put it in stone.
Today there was a black and white 1950'ish streamliner diesel engine pass by. Anyone know what and where it was from?
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
Well, the Red Cross has now announced that the Astrodome is FULL.
It took less than 24 hours.
And there are still tens of thousands in New Orleans...were are they all going to go?
And when the Alamodome gets full, then what?
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
There will be a
"Concert for Hurricane Relief" Friday 8pm on NBC & MSNBC with major entertainment stars...
Enjoy the show and please try and give!
FROM NBC: A live benefit special, "A Concert For Hurricane Relief," will be seen live Friday night on NBC.
The one-hour benefit special will be seen live at 8 p.m. Friday on NBC, MSNBC and CNBC. The broadcast will also be simulcast to XM and Sirius radio subscribers.
The music- and celebrity-driven broadcast will be hosted by NBC's Matt Lauer and will be broadcast from the New York studios of NBC, located in 30 Rockefeller Plaza. The special will feature performances by artists with ties to the affected areas, including Tim McGraw, Harry Connick Jr. and Wynton Marsalis, as well as an appearance by Leonardo DiCaprio, among many others.
All viewers will be encouraged to donate to the American Red Cross Disaster Relief Fund in support of hurricane relief through its Web site and donation hot line (RedCross.org or (800) HELP NOW). The humanitarian needs from this catastrophic hurricane are immense.
MTV, VH1, and CMT today announced the three will air a Hurricane Katrina relief live performance special on Sept. 10. The special will seek to raise funds for the American Red Cross and similar organizations, as well as promote volunteerism and general awareness.
The relief campaign will kick off with a live programming block from locations in New York, Los Angeles, Atlanta and Nashville featuring Ludacris, Green Day, Gretchen Wilson, Usher, Alicia Keys, John Mellencamp, Dave Matthews Band, Rob Thomas, David Banner, Linkin Park's Chester Bennington, and more. The special will feature performances from country, pop, rock, and hip-hop artists and will be simulcast across all three networks, as well as MTV2, mtvU, VH1 Classic, plus MTV Overdrive and VSpot, the broadband video networks.
Posted by JONATHON (Member # 2899) on :
Latest I've heard, the Gangs are Taking over New Orleans, looters threatend rescue Boats with asalt Weapons and over turned one of there boats, Rape is being comited, car-jackings, robings at gun point, and a Rescue Helicopter sent to the super Dome to help Refugies was shot at- no reson was found) anyone with more supplies than most get hurt, robed, and some times killed, one report stated that one man shot his own sister in the head for a block of Ice, New Orleans is exspected to have a higher death toll that 9-11, more poeple are being killed than they are dieing from sickness or injury, one family even tried to take an MP15 Rifle from a MP (Millitary Police) thinking it would keep them safe, I'm not sure, but I think they diclared Marshall Law on New Orleans to stop people from doing these things, that means, if your useing the Situation of this Emergency to rape, pilige, loot, steal, or comit Crime and violence of any kind, Police can Shoot you dead on the Spot, police that ARE there, were shown joining the looters in taking what was left of a Wal-Mart, people took everything, another story said that one man offered to give a ride to a family he went by, he had plenty of room for every one, and instead of letting him give them a ride, they stole his truck and left him, people are panicing, many more poeple are expected to die, when the Tsunami hit, people donated money, and some of the volentears who colected money, were stealing it, the same is exspected to happen here, so when you donate money, be sure to write a check, NOT CASH, if your not sure who to write a check to, you can make it out to the Red Cross, My Dad donated money and was aware that Cash can, and mostlikly will get stolen, there was even a web sight for donating money to Tsunami vicumes, and it turned out to be some idiot kid who was taking people's money for him self, his only comment was "I wanted get a New Car", he was arrested and the money he raised was sent, so keep that in mind when you Donate, Please
Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :
I agree, its very very sad that people can take advantage of such a terrible situation and make it worse for the people that are suffering by taking the few belongings they have left or destroying business to a further extent.
I hope the cash in money jars is not stolen, im sure some of it is though. You can also buy a card with an amount ($1-?) this is easy since you dont have to go to a "drop-off" point for the red cross nor do you have to write checks or use credit cards online or over the R.C. phone number.
Hopefuly CSX will restore there tracks soon enough and Amtrak will resume service on atleast some routes. I cant see N.O.L. getting any ridership though since I would assume it to be pretty difficult to get to the Amtrak station.
Lets all hope the best for the victims.
-Anton
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
FEMA has now contracted for 650 motorcoach buses with an additional 400 school buses to be provided by the state of Louisiana.
Thats a lot of 'moving' going on.
MSNBC is running a timer that shows "4 Days 9 Hours" since the hurricane hit.
UPDATE:
7,000-10,000 National Guard arrive in Louisiana!
Texas agrees to take in 75,000 refugees. WOW thats amazing! Bravo on Texas!
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
Amtrak will begin evacuating stranded New Orleans residents tonight.
The company will dispatch a passenger train out of Baton Rouge, La., about 7 p.m to New Orleans. From there, the service will pick up residents to Lafayette, La., where they will then be picked up by buses and ferried to varied destinations, said Marcus Mason, senior director for government affairs for Amtrak, Washington, D.C.
If all goes accordingly, the first train should pull out of New Orleans about midnight, he said.
The train will run around the clock, with a second train to join the operation in the next couple of days. It's coming from the West Coast, Mason said.
Amtrak will use freight lines owned and operated by Union Pacific Railroad, Burlington Northern SantaFe Railway and Canadian National/Illinois Central Railroad.
Armed security will be on hand to provide for an orderly evacuation, he said.
"I've heard some people (compare this) to the last helicopter out of Saigon and the last train out of Bangladesh," Mason said. "They are really hurting and need some assistance," he said.
Amtrak President David Gunn came up with the idea two days ago, according to Meridian Mayor John Robert Smith, former chairman of Amtrak.
Smith then presented that plan to U.S. Sen. Mary Landrieu, D-La., and Bill Gotshall, chief of staff for U.S. Sen. Trent Lott, R-Miss.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
I wonder what the consist of the trains will be, how many passenger cars and of what type? Any ideas? Will they be using the Amtrak Station in downtown New Orleans? And I still do not understand why the trains would be stopping in Lafayette? Why not go all the way to Houston or San Antonio? I guess they can take a portion of the 1,050 buses and send them to Lafayette to wait for the trains arrivals. The less number of transportation transfers, the better.
gp35, looks like a 'modified' version of your plan is coming into play! Adding these trains to the 1,050 busses and commercial/military aircraft already in use for the evacuation plan will expedite getting New Orleans evacuated a lot quicker.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
I just read that Amtrak will be using an 11-car Superliner and 1 Baggage car consist to run from Avondale (across the river form New Orleans) to Lafayette.... (continued)
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
Someone at www.saveourtrainsmississippi.com has apparently shot video of the evacuation train passing his house.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
I think I found the Doomed CSX Yard in that Picture,
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
JONATHON,
Well done, very nice picture. Under www.digitalglobe.com there is a heading HURRICANE KATRINA IMAGERY and after that is linked there is a subheading called DOWNTOWN NEW ORLEANS...
could you possibly post a cropped picture of the New Orleans Amtrak Station too?
THANKS!
Posted by sbalax (Member # 2801) on :
The images on digitalglobe are incredible. I was able to ID the Saks Fifth Avenue store which was on fire today and the Wyndham and so many other familiar landmarks.
Frank in calm, cool, clear SBA.
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
Evac train will not run until Tuesday the 2nd set of equipment is in houston TX and will not leave there just like the Evac train in Lafayette LA will not until at least Tuesday.
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
Amtrak is on hold with the evac train until they figure out where there going to run the trains there having a meeting tomarrow about how and where to run the trains they could be sending the trains north up to ST Louis.As far as the 2nd set of equipment it could run to Lafayette today and sit next to the 1st set.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
What are you talking about? look at the link. There is a picture of people evacuating.
Amtrak only ran 1 evac train out of Avondale abd it was yesterday.The problem is there is no more room in LA or TX to house the evacuated people so there is no sense in running more trains and adding to the problem.The thing that now could happen is take some people from LA and TX and send them north but there waiting to hear where these people can go.
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
And i need to add that only 350 people were on board the train yesterday not 600 or 650 it was 350.
Posted by gp35 (Member # 3971) on :
Oh, ok. Thanks.
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
Amtrak may yet still play a very minor role in relocating these folks as they are dispersed around the country. The Astrodome and Alamodome were never meant to be a 'home' for 16-20 weeks for these refugees but more or less a staging ground. Texas is accomodating a staggering quarter-million 'refugees' until they could be relocated to some type of housing or to other states like, Massachussets, Iowa, Michigan, Nevada, Arkansas, Arizona, North Carolina, Georgia, etc. or to other neighboring states, or even back to Louisiana. I heard on CNN that one member of the NAACP said that none of the Superdome, Convention Center, and other New Orleans refugees should have ever left Louisiana, that they should have been kept in-state to maintain 'neighborhoods' and 'community'. I dont think that Louisiana, much less any state, could have handled it, not a quarter-million of them.
The airlines and military airlift will most likely come into play now as hundreds upon thousands of these folks are scattered across the US to temporary housing.
Posted by JONATHON (Member # 2899) on :
quote:Originally posted by dmwnc1959: JONATHON,
Well done, very nice picture. Under www.digitalglobe.com there is a heading HURRICANE KATRINA IMAGERY and after that is linked there is a subheading called DOWNTOWN NEW ORLEANS...
could you possibly post a cropped picture of the New Orleans Amtrak Station too?
THANKS!
I think I found it, are those Superliners?- probly not, but they do look like it kinda
Posted by sbalax (Member # 2801) on :
If you have been watching CNN's coverage from MSY you know that the airlines are, indeed, part of the evacuation though "Operation Air Care".
As part of the Continental "family" I also know that CO was able to get a 737-800 into MSY on Wednesday with water, toiletries, and other supplies. They left with a number of stranded passengers (this was before the airport became a triage center). To their credit, the airport based employees chose to stay and help with the relief effort.
Frank in sunny SBA
Posted by dmwnc1959 (Member # 2803) on :
THANKS Frank in sunny SBA...
I had not heard of operation air care until your post, 'Googled' it and came up with this in case anyone else had not heard of it either...
---------------------------------------
12 Airlines Launch 'Operation Air Care'
Program will provide emergency airlift services to over 25,000 stranded New Orleans residents.
September 2, 2005: 6:03 PM EDT
NEW YORK (CNN/Money) - The airline industry Friday launched an enormous all-volunteer operation to airlift over 25,000 stranded New Orleans residents to safety.
"Operation Air Care" had its first flight to the city Friday morning at 8 a.m., and has indicated it will continue until relief efforts are completed.
Planes depart from Louis Armstrong New Orleans International Airport and fly to sites designated by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, such as Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas.
This extraordinary civilian airlift is unprecedented in U.S. history, and is a shining example of how America can come together to help those in need," said Air Transport Association President James C. May in a statement. "Our member airlines have willingly offered to help the federal government get the job done and we will continue these efforts until they are no longer needed."
The airlines participating in the effort are Alaska, America West, American, ATA, Continental, Delta, Jet Blue, Northwest, Southwest, United, US Airways, and Air Canada.
Cargo carriers are also involved in the relief effort, including ASTAR Air Cargo, Federal Express and UPS Airlines.
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
The equipment is on hold for good 1 more set of equipment is headed for Lafayette LA we will have 3 sets of equipment in the BNSF Lafayette Yard until further notice there having a meeting on Tue 9-6-2005 there trying to figure out where to start hauling the people to and from what city's.
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
Here is the link to view some Amtrak evacuation tran pictures i took from the BNSF Lafayette yard in Lafayette LA
Posted by BNSF 1088 (Member # 2400) on :
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
