Hey, folks, I'm planning next year's vacation and I have a question: I know Amtrak discontinued the Thrulines bus from St. Albans to Montreal, but is there any way I could get from there to there on a Greyhound or equivalent?
Posted by jp1822 (Member # 2596) on :
You may be able to catch a bus in Burlington. Get off at the Essex-Burlington Amtrak station stop and there may be bus service from downtown Burlington to Vermont. I can't remember whether the bus company is Vermont Transit or Vermont Trailways. Course their even may be a Greyhound bus schedule to Montreal for all I know.
There is a pretty descent bus depot in Burlington - ironically near the old Burlington Union Train Station.
You can probably call Amtrak and ask them for what bus company provides service at Burlington. They often have this information.
Course this would require a one night stay in Burlington to probably get the bus, since it is not coordinated with the Vermonter to Montreal any more. Downtown Burlington is a great place to spend the night - or a few days!
I try to escape up to Burlington about four times a year, taking the Adirondack up to Plattsburgh (Car Rental from there to Burlington) or Port Kent (Ferry to Burlington) and then return via the Vermonter. I've often gotten this routine down to leaving on a Friday and returning on a Sunday. Short trip - but scenery on the Adirondack and Vermonter is worth the trip alone!
Southbound Vermonter gives you more daylight viewing of Vermont.
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
Thanks! I'll look into that. I hadn't intended Burlington as a stop, but I may like it. I just hope the trains I intend to ride will still be running. They are ( in this order): Silver Meteor (from Richmond) Vermonter (to Burlington-Montreal) VIA Corridor (maybe as far as Niagara Falls- return) Ocean Limited (to Halifax, St. John, Quebec City) Chaleur (to/from Gaspe) Adirondack (to NYP) Clocker (to Philadelphia) Pennsylvanian (to Pittsburgh) Capitol Limited (to Washington) Amtrak Corridor (to Richmond). I'm going to see if I can get off the Adirondack north of N.Y. and catch a Metro North train to Grand Central. Just for the experience and to add NYC as a station I actually used. Maybe that's just me.
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
Jerome, That is a very ambitious and wonderful trip you have planned! One question: Why take the Silver Meteor from Richmond north to NYC, rather than a Regional train (Amtrak Corridor) that will get you there more reliably? Also, I thought the Regionals went from a nicer station in Richmond? (I've never gotten off there. . . .)
I agree with JP, Burlington is a nice city, esp downtown/by Lake Champlain and up near the U of VT too. I have never taken the Vermonter but believe it does not go to downtown Burlington but rather to Essex Junction, sort of a suburb; I don't know what they have to get you to downtown Burlington, but even a taxi wouldn't be too much, I don't think. . .
With regard to connections to Montreal, I've never done it (we always take the Adirondack to Montreal because we live upstate NY) but I am pretty sure the long-distance bus line is Vermont Transit http://www.vermonttransit.com.
I am jealous of all your VIA Rail plans. I've never been on the Ocean Ltd or Chaleur but would love to go some time (be careful, though I think at least one of them is not a daily train).
But I have taken the VIARail between Montreal and Quebec City. That run (about 3 hrs) is pleasant, though nothing special, but I love both cities--the historical part of Quebec is a gem, looks more European than much of Europe! And the food in both is just fantabulous too.
The Adirondack is a beautiful ride--be sure to sit on the left side facing forward on the southbound run and, if possible, change sides at or just before Albany so you are on the right facing forward for the Albany to NYC part at the end. (The train can be crowded in summer though, so you might have a little trouble doing that, esp if you travel Fri, Sat, Sun, or Mon--if so, you can probably just go into the lounge for views in this last part of the trip)
What you need to do to come into Grand Central instead of Penn Station in NYC is to take Metro North, one of NYC's suburban commuter lines. The best place for you to change from Amtrak to Metro North would be Croton-Harmon (often called just Croton for short), a pretty nice (in a space agey way) new suburban station with a fair amount of suburban train action, a bit less than an hour north of NYC. However, keep in mind, the Adirondack does take a while, and it can be late. It's never been more than 1-1/2 hours late when I've taken it (6 times), but, hey, you never know! So what I advise you do is buy your ticket to go all the way from Montreal to NYP but get off at the Croton-Harmon stop as long as the Adirondack is not running super disgusto late; and then in Croton, buy a ticket to catch a Metro North train down to Grand Central Station--I believe they have at least one train an hour and run fairly late (you can check Metro North schedules at http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/mnr/ . I am pretty certain the Amtrak fare from Montreal to NYP is the same as the fare from Montreal to Croton (at least, this year) so there's no point buying your ticket to Croton if there's a chance the train will be super disgusto late and you won't want to get off there!
If the train IS super disgusto late, then just take it all the way to NYC (where I assume you are staying overnight?) and do a round trip on Metro North to and from Grand Central the next day. Then you can pick any Metro North stop that interests you. . . .
BTW, I took a ferry over to Hoboken, NJ (you need to take the ferry to Hoboken SOUTH, not the other stop) when in NYC and then a local PATH train back. I had a great lunch there and walked around. I really liked the nice old station in Hoboken--a very busy station too, even though Amtrak doesn't stop there! (The PATH train leaves from just by it; the main station has NJ Central trains, which I didn't take; costs more to NYC; PATH is just $1.50). I guess you should really do it the other way, PATH to Hoboken and ferry back, for the views. The ferry from Hoboken South goes to downtown manhattan, my favorite part.
Posted by graynt (Member # 17) on :
Sounds like a great plan. I just rode the Chaleur a couple of weeks ago. It runs only three days a week leaving Montreal at 6:30PM. I didn t have all that time off, so I just rode to Perce, which is a couple of stops from Gaspe, the end of the line, took a cab to the Perce Rock and the downtown section and came back on the Southbound train about five hours later.The scenery is incredible. You ll be hugging the St Lawrence and at some points you will really be elevated and have some great views. The dome car is one of the great features, available to all passengers and the food in the diner is very reasonably priced. I had the Pot Roast dinner for under $10, and that was the highest priced menu item.
The Ocean runs the same route but goes on to Halifax. They disconnect the Chaleur cars in Matampedia(sp) Quebec. The Ocean runs every day but Tuesday. I think there is a Westin hotel right by the station in Halifax. Both trains give you a very nice French experience. Most of the passengers spoke French, but all the train personnell were bilingual. I was sitting across from a woman who only spoke French. I have a very limited French vocabulary and at dinner we passed some maginificent scenery. Trying to convey. my feelings I said "Manufique" and she understood.
The coach seats are very comfortable. I spent both nights in coach with no problem. I had a seat to myself and they give you a blanket and a decent sized pillow.
Whatever you do, enjoy. It s quite an experience.
Posted by City of Miami (Member # 2922) on :
I am taking the trip jp1822 mentions on Oct 2 and 3, i.e. the Adirondack north to Port Kent, ferry to Burlington, overnight in the Tibetan Guest House, then the Vermonter from Essex Junction back to NYC. Looking forward to it enormously.
I envy the Quebec and Nova Scotia rides but due to a youthful indiscretion I am persona non grata in Canada. They ask $400 to even reconsider their 30-years-old misdecision. I'd rather spend it on trains!
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
What is the Tibetan Guest House, and where in Burlington is it? Is it expensive?
Posted by Dave Burden (Member # 88) on :
You could also take the Vermonter just to White River Jct, VT and get the Vermont Transit bus to Montreal from there. The train station and bus terminal are about 1 mile apart so a taxi ride would be fairly cheap.
Dave
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
Folks, this is some great advice, and I thank all of you! I just downloaded & printed all of those schedules. Sojourner, the Silver Meteor IS a cattle car sometimes, even when it's on time. In fact, a lot of times the passengers boarding in Richmond have been seated in the lounge car until Washington, where coach seats are then available. Some of my worst train riding experiences have been on this train. And the remote Staples Mill Station is no picnic either. But last time I looked, Amtrak provided a connection from it to the Vermonter (formerly Montrealer). The Meteor is the only train that allows me to do a day trip to New York or Philadelphia by train, because of its morning arrival in the NEC and it's the last train leaving those cities in the evening. The first Regional would get me into Washington about 15-20 minutes before the Vermonter leaves, and it loses ground Northward. And good lookout on the Grand Central idea. I never thought about doing a round trip to/from GCT the next day! It's really good to share advice like this! And graynt, thanks for the word about Perce.I had planned to stay in Gaspe a couple of days and rent a car because I didn't know how far the VIA station is from the Rock, and if I would have time to tour it before the Chaleur returned. The cab ride might be do-able.
Posted by MDRR (Member # 2992) on :
FWIW, speaking from experience, the Meteor misses its connection with the Vermonter at least 80% of the time due to OT performance. Then your options become overnight in DC/NY or train to Springfield Mass. and Taxi to destination (in terms of "guaranteed connection").
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
Jerome.....
I have just returned from spending MANY hours in Staples Mill Road. EVERYTHING is delayed always right now. I would not expect to make a same day connection from the northbound Silver Meteor to the Vermonter. For three consecutive days I observed the northbound Meteor 4-5 hours late.
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
WHOA!! Looks like I'm going to have to fine-tune this a little bit! Options might include: Driving to Washington Union Station and parking my car there for the duration of the journey... Having someone take me to Washington in the wee hours, and taking the train back to Richmond at the end... Catching a Greyhound\Trailways to Washington late the previous night (I'll have to check bus schedule)... Catching the last Northbound Amtrak to Washington and spending most of the night near Union Station... Overnighting in New York and then catching Metro North to Croton-Harmon, transferring to Adirondack there ( I'll have to check Metro North schedule)... Or catching Metro North to Connecticut, then transferring to Vermonter... If I catch Adirondack Northbound, I may do Maritimes/Quebec first, then Ottawa/Toronto/Niagara Falls, then catch Maple Leaf to NY... This is going to need some more homework! Thanks!
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
I would take a Regional from Richmond to DC, Baltimore, Philly, NYC, or New Haven, overnight there, and catch the Vermonter next day. Or maybe in 2 days, if there is something more you want to see in the city to which you take the Regional.
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
Hey, that's not a bad idea; I'd choose Baltimore. It's an ideal place for a midday arrival/ overnight. And its light rail goes from the train station to the hotels along the Harborplace. NY and Philly are a bit too far to ride a Regional-I'd prefer a full breakfast in the Meteor/Star's dining car over the microwaved Amsandwiches in the Regionals. But after reading of notelvis' tales of woe in my neck of the woods, the Regionals are looking better by default. BTW, Wilmington, Delaware is along the way. I've been THROUGH it lots of times but never TO it. I wonder if that city would be an interesting overnighter? Posted by CN 6060 Fan (Member # 3093) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jerome Nicholson: Thanks! I'll look into that. I hadn't intended Burlington as a stop, but I may like it. I just hope the trains I intend to ride will still be running. They are ( in this order): Silver Meteor (from Richmond) Vermonter (to Burlington-Montreal) VIA Corridor (maybe as far as Niagara Falls- return) Ocean Limited (to Halifax, St. John, Quebec City) Chaleur (to/from Gaspe) Adirondack (to NYP)
There’s a new option now for anyone in the Northeast wanting to ride VIA’s Ocean:
Take Amtrak’s Downeaster from Boston to Portland and connect with the highspeed “Cat Ferry” to Yarmouth, NS. Takes about 6 hours and runs on Fri. Sat. & Sun. (the other days it runs from Bar Harbor, Maine) You would have to overnight in Yarmouth and catch a bus or shuttle van the next morning to Halifax arriving in time to connect with the Ocean at 12:30pm.
Have you considered having someone take you to Fredericksburg, and then you can take the VRE into DC to get the Vermonter?
I'm assuming the schedule should be much more friendly to making the connection.
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
Jerome, I don't know about spending time on the Regional vs spending it on the Vermonter--I haven't been on the Vermonter but to me it sounds a lot like a Regional! Though no doubt going through some very pretty terrain once it gets into New England, of course, the part from DC to NYC will be the same old same old regardless of which train, won't it?
But I do think you are right that if you overnight somewhere on the Regional line to catch the Vermonter, it's better to get off earlier; after all, if you are paying for a hotel, you may as well get to the place early enough to see/do the most stuff! Wilmington is just 20 min S of Philly; although the to-me most interesting things to see nearby (New Castle to the S, Winterthur, Longwood, Brandywine Wyeth museum to the N) are too far away, I believe there is an Old Town downtown and you can walk on the Brandywine River and maybe get up to that one DuPont house that is closer to the city? But I've never been to any of these except Longwood and the Wyeth museum, loved them, but a friend met me with a car at Wilmington when I was coming back from DC. I suspect DC, Baltimore or Philly would be nicer than Wilmington (and likely better food in DC or Philly) OTOH Wilmington hotel might be cheaper. . .
Of course, "I Miss the M&P" 's VRE idea will save you all that. Or maybe you could even drive to Fredericksburg yourself and leave your own car there someplace? I wonder if they have a good safe parking place there. . . .
CN, I am glad to hear a Portland ferry to Nova Scotia is back in business. I was looking into this when I was planning a long circle trip perhaps all the way to Newfoundland and was sorry to hear the old one went OOB. I guess it's time to start planning again! Too bad it's only on weekends. Is there a bus from Bar Harbor to Portland for other days? All this talk of Ocean/Chaleur has me thinking . . . .
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jerome Nicholson: Hey, that's not a bad idea; I'd choose Baltimore. It's an ideal place for a midday arrival/ overnight. And its light rail goes from the train station to the hotels along the Harborplace. NY and Philly are a bit too far to ride a Regional-I'd prefer a full breakfast in the Meteor/Star's dining car over the microwaved Amsandwiches in the Regionals. But after reading of notelvis' tales of woe in my neck of the woods, the Regionals are looking better by default. BTW, Wilmington, Delaware is along the way. I've been THROUGH it lots of times but never TO it. I wonder if that city would be an interesting overnighter?
In planning the trip I just took I learned that there is a Red Roof Inn very near the Timonium Business Park light rail station north of downtown Baltimore. That would be more reasonably priced than staying at the Inner Harbour. As for what to do in Baltimore......besides the B&O museum catching an Orioles game is always an easy fallback.
I'll keep my eye on the Timonium Red Roof as a future option......on this trip I opted for the Henry Clay because I figured I would arrive there before 11:00pm. I wasn't so sure I could count on making it all the way to Baltimore before my bedtime!
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
David, I'll look into the Red Roof as a future option as well; never hurtsto save a few bux when possible. Ma&Pa, Fredericksburg /VRE might be an idea. I'll have to cheky out their station area and see if there is secure, cheap parking. CN6060, I thought about the Maine-NB ferry. I rode the Downeaster in 2004 from Boston to Wells, ME to see the Kennebunkport Streetcar Museum. That was part of a Boston vacation that included Lowell (the textile mill), and Hyannis (a whale watching cruise and the Cape Cod Scenic Railway). Thing is, I went to Boston on the Federal overnight from DC in a Viewliner bedroom. I don't know if I would do it in a coach seat either day or night.The biggest alternative I could think of was to fly to Boston, but I came up with the NY-MontreaL train plan. I could still do the ferry, but I would have to cut out either the Vermonter or the Adirondack one way. Can we put our heads together? I'm sure someone has a viable suggestion.
Posted by jp1822 (Member # 2596) on :
This is the first year that a new operator is serving Portland, ME and Yartmouth, NS. It's seasonal, and only operating on weekends at present. This service could be expanded next season - or cut, depending on how it does this year. I am not sure if I would rely on this ferry if you are planning a year out and this is the first year the ferry is running.
I thought all was ok and made plans to ride the ferry from Portland to Yartmouth - then that operator went out of business, as noted in a previous post. The old operator had a more regular and frequent schedule between Portland and Yartmouth, if I recall correctly.
But the ferry service is from Portland, ME to Yartmouth, Nova Scotia (unless you book some sort of extended boat trip). So you would have to get a bus connection from Yartmouth, NS to Halifax - long time on a bus for me! I'd rent a car, but not sure if a rental agency would allow this one-way trip, or if they did, I am sure it would be a nice bill for the one-way drop fee - in Halifax.
By the way - the name of the Hotel adjacent to the VIA Rail Station in Halifax is the Westin Nova Scotian. It's nice, and if the budget can allow it, book a room with a water view. This hotel is walkable to the main attractions in downtown. There are some more centralized hotels, but I still prefer this hotel for my Halifax trips.
Your above trip involves the "Clocker." Clockers are history. But you can easily take a Regional or a Keystone train between NYC and Philly, which essentially has taken the place of the Clockers. Could also opt for the cheap route and take NJT to Trenton and then SEPTA from Trenton to Philly (these are the regional commuter trains and operate alongside Amtrak trains on the NEC). I go to Philly often, but still prefer an Amtrak Keystone or Regional train, rather than the cheaper (and longer) way out via NJT and SEPTA.
Good luck!
Posted by Jerome Nicholson (Member # 3116) on :
Good points. The reason I'm doing this so early is because I thought VIA LD trains sell out really fast and I don't want to have to be on a waiting list because all the seats/rooms/bunks were sold out. How far in advance should I book my VIA tickets? And does the Chaleur carry a dining car or is everyone fed in its Skyline car? Can the passengers of the Chaleur and Ocean pass between both consists when they are coupled together?
Posted by Tanner929 (Member # 3720) on :
The Staples Road station in Richmond VA is a 1980 nothing. If you can catch the train from the Renovated Main Street Station it would add to your experience. if you are looking to detrain north of NYC on your return trip the Yonkers NY station is also a great old New York Central Station that has been refurbished as well.
"The character of a town can be judged by how it cares for its Railroad Stations."
I heard that the St Albans to Montreal Bus runs during the summer? perhaps that was last year.
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Looks like I'm going to have to fine-tune this a little bit! Options might include:![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
the Regionals are looking better by default. ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
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