This question is for those of you who have already experienced "simplified dining service." I'll be on the Starlight next week, and I'm wondering which food items on the menu are decent, and which, if any, are to be avoided. I'm particularly concerned about breakfast. I like pancakes or French toast. My last Amtrak French toast was the best ever, but that was then....
Posted by SunsetLtd (Member # 3985) on :
For Dinner the Ravioli was good on my trip to Austin back in March on the Sunset/Eagle, the Burger wasn't too bad for Lunch either.
Posted by dilly (Member # 1427) on :
Steer clear of the "stir fry vegetables." I made the mistake of ordering it -- twice -- on the Crescent and the California Zephyr, figuring that it couldn't possibly be as bad the second time around.
The main ingredient is salt -- so much of it that it made my meal completely inedible. Considering the amount of processed garbage I've consumed in Amtrak's cafe cars over the years, that's saying quite a bit.
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Posted by 20thCenturyLimited (Member # 1108) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mr. Toy: This question is for those of you who have already experienced "simplified dining service." I'll be on the Starlight next week, and I'm wondering which food items on the menu are decent, and which, if any, are to be avoided. I'm particularly concerned about breakfast. I like pancakes or French toast. My last Amtrak French toast was the best ever, but that was then....
I'll be trying Simplified Dining when I travel via sleeper aboard the SILVER STAR to Tampa in March 2007.
Posted by dilly (Member # 1427) on :
Almost forgot. . .
If you find yourself traveling on a train that has the words "Lamb Shanks" on the menu, do yourself a favor: pretend that you don't see them.
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Posted by Ray S (Member # 3175) on :
I did several long distance trips this summer. I did not think the french toast was very good. I tried it a couple of times as I like french toast. Also not a huge fan of the scramble. I had omelets a couple of times and both were good. Sides on each meal were pretty good. Hash browns,croissants and sausage.
After a big breakfast I usually skipped lunch but burger was ok.
Posted by HopefulRailUser (Member # 4513) on :
The burger was OK, not great. The French toast was tasty but had a texture like cardboard. Anything without a sauce - salmon, baked chicken - was dry, dry, dry. I actually liked the "special" chicken fried steak. Gravy can cover a multitude of sins. Desserts were good, chocolate bundt cake and cheesecake although they were served still frozen once. Lamb shanks were edible but not a favorite and beef bourgignon could have been out of a Healthy Choice frozen meal package. Over all, I found the food very disappointing. Would definitely not pay for it if in coach.
Posted by Judy McFarland (Member # 4435) on :
Watch out for the omelet with the "vegetarian ham" - I have no idea what that might be & neither did the dining steward. I didn't sit with anyone brave enough to order it on the Empire Builder.
Posted by yukon11 (Member # 2997) on :
I agree with HopefulRailUser. I traveled on the CS this summer, taking advantage of the dinner lite cuisine. For dinner, the "Beef Burgoyne" wasn't bad. I wanted to try the chicken, but they ran out. For lunch, the burger was pretty good..but I would like to try other items on the lunch menu. For breakfast, I would skip this meal. The french toast was tough and not tasty, Bob's Scramble unapalatable. I think, next time, I will pack a thermos of coffee and bring along some bagels.
If you get a sleeper, after reading a few posts, it looks like there will not be a Pacific Parlor car...too bad. Sure hope they bring it back by next year.
Give us a report, Mr. Toy, on meals you liked and did not like...I'm sure it would be of interest to everyone.
Richard
Posted by CoastStarlight99 (Member # 2734) on :
Anyone tried the braised beef? I have only been on a LD train once since Dinner Lite began and did not have enough time to get a meal reservation. With no steak options, I am wondering if the only other beef option (besides Burgoyne) is edible.
Posted by wayne72145 (Member # 4503) on :
I was on the Starlite in August and enjoyed the Chicken Ceasar for lunch, but it 's really hard to mess up a salad. Next month I'll be taking the Silver Star--Capitol Limited--Empire Builder from Tampa to Portland with my grandson. He is a huge fan of the Mississippi Mud pie. I gain 10 pounds looking at it.
Posted by Ray S (Member # 3175) on :
After my many summer train trips including the Empire Builder I found lunch and dinner no better or worse than pre simplified dining. Except for the Empire Builder breakfast is not as good as it used to be in my opinion.
Chicken can be moist and tasty or overheated and dry. Same with beef items. To me it has always been that way. Regular or simplified dining. Luck of the draw.
A couple of times I had later breakfast and lunch. I would snack around dinner and then have the dining stewards fix me a desert to go back to my room.
Posted by PaulB (Member # 4258) on :
I was on the Starlight (#11) this past Sunday. This was my second encounter with Simplified Dining.
To my horror, they were using (bad) xeroxed copies of the menu! Just folded pieces of copier paper for the menu! Don't know what was up with that. The menu was #2, which can be seen here: http://www.amtrak.com/pdf/menus/SampleMenu2_6-1-2006.pdf
Since I was only traveling between SLO and LA, I only had dinner. I had the Beef Ragout. These were little medallions of beef in a sauce, served with veggies (brocolli and carrots) and your choice of baked potato, mashed, or rice. I went with the baked. Unfortunately, the beef is still the same kind you would use in a stew. Very soft meat. The baked potato came out well-it was actually baked instead of reheated/microwaved! One of my tablemates ordered the lamb, which she said was very good. Another ordered the "special" which was (surprise!) Chicked Fried Steak. Unfortunately, it comes with PORK gravy over the top-the same kind you would use for a biscuit. She couldn't eat it due to all the pork in it. None of us had ever seen pork gravy on chicken fried steak. So beware of this if you don't like pork.
All of us ordered the Mississippi Mud Pie (they were out of cheesecake) which was described as "sinfully delicious".
We also had one of those managers on board that are managing the simplified dining. He would help with waiting on tables, ask people how their meal was, if he could get anything for them, etc. When my tablemate couldn't eat the chicked fried steak, he said "No Problem" and switched it for a beef ragout plate. She liked the beef much better.
For breakfast, Mr. Toy, looks like you're stuck with the french toast. Pancakes are a thing of the past, as are freshly cooked eggs to order.
Posted by PaulB (Member # 4258) on :
I had french toast both pre and post Simplified Dining cutover, and I've found they taste the same. So that's a plus. I'd stay away from the gray-colored sausages though.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
Thanks for the input. It is nice to see everyone's impressions all in one place. It may be, as Ray suggested, that the quality varies with who is in the kitchen, which is how it was before as well. So I'll see how it goes next week, and I'll report back. I hope the French toast is decent, or I'll send it back and get cereal.
I read somewhere that fresh eggs may make a comeback due to customer pressure. I also read a rumor that Starlight crews have been microwaving items that are supposed to go in the convection oven, but maybe by now they'e been properly trained.
Posted by Navillus68 (Member # 4603) on :
I am a 'newbie' to this board. What is "Simplified Dining"? I am going to be travelling on the Southwest Chief going to Kansas city on 09 December and returning on 17 December. Is "Simplified Dining" applicable to this trip? Also, how can I upload a menu of what they will be serving on these two trips? Is there any way to tell ahead of time?? Thanks in advance for any help I can get with my questions!
Posted by tommers207 (Member # 3930) on :
quote:Originally posted by Navillus68: Also, how can I upload a menu of what they will be serving on these two trips?
quote:Originally posted by espeefoamer: I will be riding the Southwest Chief in December. I will skip breakfast and eat an early lunch and late dinner.
If you're traveling sleeper, get your money's worth and get the continental breakfast. You'll be hungry by the time lunchtime rolls around.
Posted by DeeCT (Member # 3241) on :
Train Lady is right -- that is a link to the old menu. This is a link to the current Simplified Dining Menu. It leads you to a page where you can view 3 different ones. (Have never seen any other).
As every has said --- it is hit or miss. I do believe part of the problem is that food is being heated in the microwave that is designed to be heated in a convection oven. But that does not explain the pathetic salad offering. I have had that 1/2 chicken several times - sometimes good -- sometimes so overcooked that it resembles leather. It depends on the cook evidently. (In their defense - most were trained to be chefs or at least cooks and not trained to be food re-heaters). If you want "safe" for breakfast I suggest sticking with the Continental. The Angus burger is okay if not overcooked and the condiments make it palatable. Evening meal is an adventure. I suggest if it is not to your liking on second bite send it back and request another meal. My one definite do not order is the strange gray sausage offered at breakfast. I also would never, ever order the cod again. the Thyme and Basil was way overdone and the fish dry.
As I have said in the past -- there is a sameness to the three available menu offerings. Quite noticable if you ride three or four LD trains in a three week period as I did last Spring when Simplified Dining was begun.
Dee
Posted by 20thCenturyLimited (Member # 1108) on :
Who is doing the catering now for Amtrak?
Posted by Beacon Hill (Member # 4431) on :
I posted this link before, Cuisine Solutions is a food service company that provides food for airlines, hotels, caterers and apparently Amtrak. If you go down the list you'll find just about every Simplified Dining Service entree. Someone else mentioned that some of the selections are also available at Costco, so know before you go.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
quote:Originally posted by Navillus68: I am a 'newbie' to this board. What is "Simplified Dining"?
Welcome, Navillus. Simplified dining is the product of Washington DC politics. Last year someone on Capitol Hill slipped a provision into an Amtrak appropriations bill which required Amtrak to dramatically reduce its food service costs. This was from some Congresscritters who are generally hostile to Amtrak. It amounts to micromanaging through legislation.
In response Amtrak introduced systemwide last May a new form of dining car service which requires far less labor. The food is now prepared off site, and is intended to be reheated in convections ovens - not microwaves - to preserve flavor. Theoretically, if done correctly, it is supposed to be virtually indistinguishable from freshly prepared meals. However, many popular foods are not possible to prepare this way, so things like eggs prepared to order are no longer available.
Also, as has been reported above, some crews are apparently bypassing the convection ovens and using microwaves anyway. Perhaps the convection ovens are too slow for the one chef to keep up with demand. I'm just guessing there, but it explains why some people report decent meals and others have unfavorable experiences.
In addition, to save dishwashing costs, food is now served on disposable plastic plates which are supposed to look and feel somewhat like real china.
Amtrak says they are monitoring customer response and making adjustments as needed. They seem genuinely eager to avoid a repeat of the 1980s debacle involving mircowaved TV dinners. But the jury is still out as to whether this effort will be successful.
I hope this answers your question. Again, welcome and I hope you will remain among us as a regular.
Posted by 20thCenturyLimited (Member # 1108) on :
quote:Originally posted by Beacon Hill: Someone else mentioned that some of the selections are also available at Costco, so know before you go.
I've never expected fine dining on Amtrak, not even when the meals were prepared on board.
Posted by Judy McFarland (Member # 4435) on :
On the Empire Builder in September, the plates were Corelle decorated with the Amtrak logo. I looked at the bottom of the plate to verify that it was indeed Corelle & not disposable plastic. Maybe this is the railroad china of the 21st cenetury (LOL).
The biggest food complaint I had is that the vegetable for every dinner (5 dinners on 3 different trains) was broccoli (which I can't eat) or absolutely inedible green beans (big, fat & tough - UGH).
Posted by DeeCT (Member # 3241) on :
[/QUOTE]I've never expected fine dining on Amtrak, not even when the meals were prepared on board. [/QB][/QUOTE]
Nor do I expect "Chez Fancy" five star dining. That said I do expect a decent family style meal. Translate that as simple, tasty and other than dry cardboard/leather texture. I want hot foods hot, cold foods cold and salads crisp. A little variety would help. I do not think that is an unreasonable expectation.
As a sleeper car passenger I am forced to pay for these meals as part of my accomodation fee. (Trust me there is no such thing as "free" amenities.)
Dee
Posted by 20th Century (Member # 2196) on :
I agree with you Dee. Maybe the microwaving will stop and the directions on the package will be followed. I guess they don't need cooks in the kitchen any more. Just someone who can follow the package's directions. Any way I read that to further cut costs Amtrak might consider not including meals in the sleeper fare. Don't ask my source 'cause I can't recall and question the credibility. But the way things are going I wouldn't be surprised.
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
So the meals have become unappealing and they may decide not to include them in sleeper fare? I am so glad our politicians know how to run Amtrak like a business.
Now all they have to do is raise prices to minimize losses, ...or maybe they should let the free market determine the price and bail out the food provider for their losses in return for a campaign contribution. Then we would really be running Amtrak like a business.
Posted by PaulB (Member # 4258) on :
quote:Originally posted by Judy McFarland: On the Empire Builder in September, the plates were Corelle decorated with the Amtrak logo. I looked at the bottom of the plate to verify that it was indeed Corelle & not disposable plastic. Maybe this is the railroad china of the 21st cenetury (LOL).
The biggest food complaint I had is that the vegetable for every dinner (5 dinners on 3 different trains) was broccoli (which I can't eat) or absolutely inedible green beans (big, fat & tough - UGH).
The Empire Builder and Auto Train are the exceptions to Simplified Dining. They are supposed to still have real china and glasses, as well as use a traditional menu pre-Simplified Dining. That means steaks, pancakes, and eggs are still on the menu, and there are still 2-3 personnel in the kitchen instead of just 1.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
So what makes the Empire Builder and Auto Train so special? Answer: They are getting all of the political attention. The Auto train is popular with the east coast retirees who mostly vote Republican, and the Empire Builder has better political backing from the states it serves, particularly Montana.
The rest of us are left out. We're second class.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
quote:Originally posted by PaulB: The Empire Builder and Auto Train are the exceptions to Simplified Dining. They are supposed to still have real china and glasses, as well as use a traditional menu pre-Simplified Dining. That means steaks, pancakes, and eggs are still on the menu, and there are still 2-3 personnel in the kitchen instead of just 1.
Actually Paul Scannergeek,the beef dish offered on the AT is Beef Tournedoes (served on ceramicware, with glassware, metal flatware, and 'comp, yet drinkable' Virginia varietals) in a red wine sauce. Very good last time I had it. The Coach class fare is casseroles such as lasagna. AT breafast for both classes is quite simplified; a Continental Breakfast consisting of rolls, orange juice and coffee.
quote:Originally posted by Mr. Toy: So what makes the Empire Builder and Auto Train so special? Answer: They are getting all of the political attention. The Auto train is popular with the east coast retirees who mostly vote Republican, and the Empire Builder has better political backing from the states it serves, particularly Montana.
Somehow, Mr. Toy, it seems most of the Bennie-Caddy-Lex crowd aboard AT when I ride, is from Blue States. I've done so fifteen times over the years, and it always looks to me as if my auto is the only one with tags away from the NEC states - excepting of course Florida (of which the East Coast really is just an outpost of the Corridor).
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
Hi, I'm just back from my fall travels and will post of them elsewhere.
I have now had the simplified menu several times. I find the breakfasts OK, except with the egg dishes or Continental breakfast, sometimes the only "bread" is a croissant (not even the biscuit alternative), which is very limiting. I wish there were toast. Also wish the fruit included a banana. (I don't see why they cannot have bananas and apples on the train, not to mention ice cream!)
The lunch selection is very limited. I find the hamburgers bloody awful, and the gardenburgers worse. The chicken pizza is erratic, sometimes undercooked and inedible. The chicken thing, though, is tasty enough, as is the roll it's on--I recommend that.
The beef tips, plain roast chicken, and catfish are your best bets for dinner, though if you are paying cash, I'd get the cheapest--prices are way too high. Dilly, the lamb (or pork) shanks are sometimes OK and sometimes awful--depends on if they are overcooked and dried out. The chicken-fried steak is occasionally OK but more often ice cold. The pasta dish has seemed very dried out and bad when I've seen it--I never ordered it myself--maybe that depends on how it's cooked. Worst of all was something call turkey tenderloin wrapped in bacon--it's pressed meat, very fake, avoid it at all costs.
For starch vegetable, I liked the baked potato best. For the other vegetable, if corn is a choice, get that. Carrots and broccoli are rather blah but you can doctor them up with butter and pepper if you aren't on a diet.
For dessert, I like the cheesecake best but the chocolate cake is OK too. They also offer fruit, same as the fruit for the Continental breakfast.
Posted by 20thCenturyLimited (Member # 1108) on :
quote:Originally posted by DeeCT: Nor do I expect "Chez Fancy" five star dining. That said I do expect a decent family style meal. Translate that as simple, tasty and other than dry cardboard/leather texture. I want hot foods hot, cold foods cold and salads crisp. A little variety would help. I do not think that is an unreasonable expectation.
As a sleeper car passenger I am forced to pay for these meals as part of my accomodation fee. (Trust me there is no such thing as "free" amenities.)
Dee
What I was responding to was the comment:
"Someone else mentioned that some of the selections are also available at Costco, so know before you go."
Posted by zephyr (Member # 1651) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mr. Toy: So what makes the Empire Builder and Auto Train so special? Answer: They are getting all of the political attention. The Auto train is popular with the east coast retirees who mostly vote Republican, and the Empire Builder has better political backing from the states it serves, particularly Montana.
The rest of us are left out. We're second class.
Ah, culinary connoisseurs, a recipe that's a forum favorite:
A pinch of whining;
A dash of partisan bombast;
Two cups of demagoguery.
Mix thorougly until frothy, and then throw against the wall. Scrape off what sticks.
Wah, lah......
Wonk de Toy.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
Zephyr, rather than attacking me personally, how about offering your explanation as to why two trains get better food service than the rest.
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
I think Auto Train and the Empire Builder are the two best financial performers of the LD's. I did read somewhere that the annual revenue from the Empire Builder was $4.2 million, even before it was "re-launched" for a full year.
It is hard for me to believe it costs more than that to run it, and I suspect "funny math" cost allocation is a factor in overstating losses from LD's. But that debate will go on forever.
If these 2 are the best performers, then maybe the decision makers at least have enough sense not to mess up a good thing by degrading the food service.
Posted by zephyr (Member # 1651) on :
Mr. Toy, you had the "answer" (re. the "ANSWER:..." part of your post). Just read your own post. I never claimed to possess anything near your level of omnipotence (i.e., don't claim to have "the answer") You made that claim, not I. Care to back it with a few facts?
My post asserted your post was whiny, politically partisan, and demogogic. I based my assertions on...well, just read your own post. (But please do so when your blood pressure, skin thickness, and ego-inflation are back to normal).
You know, you seem to cry "personal attack" when someone dares to disagree with you. Since your primary interest seems to be in the advocacy arena (policy wonking), may I humbly suggest you learn to deal with that. It's a contact sport, you know. From time to time, people are going disagree with you. It's just part of wonker world. Taking it personal will just make you perpetually grumpy.
Now, do you want to talk a little more about drum therapy?
Posted by Judy McFarland (Member # 4435) on :
Sorry guys, but the food on the Empire Builder was the same as on the Southwest Chief and Coast Starlight in September. The menus looked the same, the same awful green beans, the same limp salads, the same BobEvans goo. The only differences were that there were 5 dessert choices instead of 3 and they put the dressing on your salad instead of leaving a basket of salad dressings on the table. And yes, they even had photcopies of the menus instead of the laminated cards. There was a wine tasting in the diner, and the newly configured bathrooms are nice, but the food was really indistinguishable from the other LD trains on my trip. (OTOH that was the only train that had the "vegetarian ham")
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
quote:Originally posted by zephyr: You know, you seem to cry "personal attack" when someone dares to disagree with you.
Not exactly. When someone presents a coherent argument that disputes my opinions I take them seriously. When someone calls me a whiner and demagogue, and offers nothing more, I take that as a personal attack. Your post was clearly the latter, not the former.
My post was somewhat cynical, I'll admit. Amtrak has been a political football for a long time, and politics seems to govern Amtrak more than good business practices. That is just my observation.
Now, my reference to Republicans relates to a few very well known facts. 1. The Republicans have controlled Congress for the last several years. 2. It was Republicans who slipped provisions into the last apropriations bill requiring Amtrak to reduce its food service costs. 3. The Empire Builder passes through Montana. Republican Senator Conrad Burns from that state is a strong Amtrak supporter, and he is currently fighting for his political life.
Its just a suspicion, but I wonder if it is merely a coincidence that Amtrak's "premiere" train with all the bells and whistles serves a state with a Republican Senator who actively supports the train, while amenities are being cut on other routes.
As for accusations that I am "partisan" I'll just say that I plan to vote for a mix of both Republicans and Democrats on November 7.
Posted by train lady (Member # 3920) on :
an addenda, Mr. Toy. Some months back I kept reading in the newspaper many protests from many officials in Montana about proposed Amtrak cut backs. I do not remember any other state protesting to that degree. It would seem that" the squeeky wheel gets the oil". Maybe if more states had made more noise things would be different. Whenyou think about how popular the auto train is it makes sense to keep the users happy especially in an election year
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
From Ms. McFarland's report, it would appear that the Empire Builder has also gone 'SDS' (Simplified Dining Service). Oh, oh, will Auto Train be far behind?
There is good possibility I will use AT in one or both directions on my '07 Florida journey, for as I discussed at this topic, the breaking of the 30-WAS-91 connection as well as with the continued "temporary annulment" of Sunset East, has made the all rail journey from Chicago less attractive than in the past.
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
Maybe Amtrak is striving for consistency in avialability of all of their amenities: lounge cars, parlour cars, on-time service AND full menus. A strict policy of "maybe you get it and maybe you don't".
Maybe they should add a mystery meal to the adventure: "we don't know what it is but we microwaved it and this is what happened".
Posted by Ray S (Member # 3175) on :
I rode the Empire Builder on September 14-16 from Seattle to Chicago. Although I skipped lunch my two breakfasts were definately cooked to order. Eggs over easy one morning and pancakes the next.
For dinner I had chicken with a baked potato and it was tasty. Moist and skin was crispy but couldn't tell you for sure if chicken was cooked or just heated. I skipped the veggies.
Maybe the EB meals are a mix of cooked and heated??
Posted by rresor (Member # 128) on :
Ah, for that brief period in 1982 when H. Rex Holland (Graham Claytor referred to him as "His Royal Highness) from Cunard was in charge of Amtrak dining service. Roast leg of lamb with fresh mint sauce in a little bowl...or, pre-Amtrak on SCL's Florida Special, pompano stuffed with tiny shrimp, baked with sauce in a parchment bag...
Well, at least we still have on-board sit-down food service (unlike most European trains).
There's so little left of Amtrak now that I'm no longer sure I even *want* to take anything but short trips -- I'm on the 5:10 PM train this afternoon WAS to PHL, just like every Thursday.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
quote: After the first full year of enhanced service aboard the Empire Builder, which operates between Chicago and Seattle/Portland, both ridership and revenue increased. During the months between October 2005 and September 2006, ticket revenue increased by 16% percent between, reaching $48.6 million. Ridership increased by 4.3 percent to 497,020.
This certainly provides some evidence that better amenities can enhance the bottom line. I might note that this was during a year when overall LD ridership was down 1%.
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
I might add that if you check prices often during slow periods in the off season (winter), you might find some real bargains on the Empire Builder. I once got a bedroom (not roomette) from St. Paul to Portland for $125 over coach, booking shortly before departure. I think it was in early March. For 2 people, that would be about the price of the 4 meals you get free.
Posted by palmland (Member # 4344) on :
Regarding the Empire Builder food. Most of it is the same as SDS fare. However, we rode it the last week of September and I did have eggs cooked to order, steak (twice) and wonderful ice cream. That is enough of a difference to say it is a cut above the rest of the fleet. The champagne after Chicago departure was a nice touch too.
Sadly the chef must have been missing as the food was bland and overcooked. Most of it was unfortunatley like some southern cooking known locally as meat and three (choice of meat with 3 sides at one of those infortunate buffet places). Oh. macaroni counts as a vegtable. I do love good southern cooking, but this was not it. I guess the good chefs fled when they saw the handwriting on the wall about Amtrak's direction for their cusine.
I'm sure there is a policital agenda with the train but I think it has more to do with Amtrak's survival than the red state blue state thing. And no, I don't think that is necessarily the same thing. Last time I checked Trent Lott was a republican and I have a letter from Lindey Graham stating he supported funding for Amtrak.
Posted by TwinStarRocket (Member # 2142) on :
It is definitely not a "red state blue state thing". Senators Lott, Graham, Hutchison and many other Republicans are among the strongest Amtrak supporters. David Gunn was hired by a conservative think tank.
But the knee-jerk "reduce government" politicians are still going to use Amtrak as their target to score political points while they vote for their favorite pork. There are many conservatives who believe that government is involved in too many things, but that multiple transportation choices ARE a legitmate role of the federal government.