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I found two old programs for the Hollywood Bowl in my piano bench. Must have been put there by my parents. The one for 1949 had a lovely ad:
The UP "Los Angeles Limited", LA to Chicago. Leave LA at 12:01 pm, arrive Chi at 2:00 pm. Drawing rooms, compartments, bedrooms, roomettes, berths. Lounge car, dining car. Reserved Coach seats too with a new Café-Lounge car for coach patrons.
No fares noted, darn. It did state "No extra fare". Would that be compared to the Chief or some such thing? Union Station could be reached by phone at Trinity 9211.
Nice ads for Acme Beer and Phillip Morris - No Cigarette Hangover. Ah, the good old days. Very old days indeed.
notelvis Member # 3071
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I'm guessing that the 'Los Angeles Limited' may have been the secondary train on that route....
UP's flagship to SOCAL was the 'City of Los Angeles' and it, likely, commanded a premium fare.
whistler Member # 2620
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Neat. So what where the acts on the bills?
RRRICH Member # 1418
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If you are fond of old passenger rail ads, find some old (like 1930's through 1950's) National Geographic magazines -- they always had several very colorful ads for passenger trains in them.
Many years ago I bought the set of CD's for all the National Geographic magazines from 1890 to 1980-whenever that collection came out (it's probably still available in computer software stores). I don't look at it very often, but in just about every issue from the 1940's and even 1950's, there were colorful ads about the Super Chief, the Lark, the North Coast Limited, and many other classic passenger trains of the time.
HopefulRailUser Member # 4513
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Paul - The "Acts" in 1949 over three days - Jascha Heifetz, Violin Soloist doing Mozart, Debussy and Tschaikowsky; the Bowl Orchestra led by Serge Koussevitzky doing Beethoven and Sibelius; and Artur Rubinstein, Piano Soloist doing Prokofieff, Rachmaninov and Tschaikowsky.
The next year, 1950, it was a performance of The Vagabond King starring Nadine Conner, Leif Erickson, Don Wilson (yes, Jack Benny's announcer) and Lucille Norman, Francis X. Bushman had a "with" role. Upcoming was Jose Iturbi and the Spanish Dancers and a Rodgers and Hammerstein night starring Jane Powell, Johnny Green conducting and the Roger Wagner Chorale featured.
I must assume my folks attended both of these. Lots of ads for music instructors both instrument and voice as well as those new fangled 33 1/3 and 45 rpm records. The list of season ticket box subscribers was interesting too and included all five(!) of the Los Angeles newspapers. Pierre's House of Crepes Suzettes had filet mignon dinner for $2.50, crepe suzettes at $.75. You could fly to San Francisco on the DC-4 Four Engine Luxury Liner for $9.95 via Robin Airways out of Lockheed Air Terminal. You could also take the Pacific Electric trains and motor coaches to the "beach and mountain resorts" or you could buy a 152-hp Buick Roadmaster whose vertical bars on the front grill were individually replaceable; great picture of the car - wide whitewalls, the classic holes along the side of the hood and that massive grill. Remember chrome?
George Harris Member # 2077
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quote:Originally posted by HopefulRailUser: No fares noted, darn. It did state "No extra fare". Would that be compared to the Chief or some such thing? Union Station could be reached by phone at Trinity 9211.
In those ancient days, fares were regulated. Therefore, Chicago to Los Angeles fares (or between any other two points) for all permutations, coach, first class, sleeper spaces of all types were published numbers. They would be exactly the same regardless of route. In other words, the basic coach fare would be the same whether you went "Santa Fe all the way", Union Pacific, Southern Pacific "Golden State Route" or such longer ones as SP - T&P - MP - GM&O. The top trains, such as the Super Chief, City of LA, or Golden State would charge an "Extra Fare" above that amount, presumably to discourage the riff raff. Some would also have statements that certain classes of discounted tickets would not be accepted. The amount seem pretty nominal in today's economy, but at the time they were quite sufficient to cause the budget traveler to ride other trains.
royaltrain Member # 622
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Speaking of discounted fares, I remember looking at a Santa Fe timetable from the early 1960's and it said the railway would not accept certain types of tickets on the Super Chief, one of them being "Banana Messenger Tickets." I always wondered what a banana messenger was. Does anyone know?
It appears that you were "robbed' last June when your tour operator changed you and Mr. Art from the Allerton where you could (once upon a time) "march around the Breakfast table with Don McNeil".
Regarding a Tchaikovsky Festival, I have tickets to attend next month at Avery Fisher (NY).
We DO get off topic at this Forum.
train lady Member # 3920
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Gil, you are absolutely right but to me that is one of the things that makes this forum interesting and fun.
HopefulRailUser Member # 4513
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Gil, why were we robbed? The Palmer House was very nice. On the upcoming trip we are at the Four Seasons in Vancouver. Looks good to me!
Zephyr - interesting Banana Messenger stuff.
Connie - you said it!!!
royaltrain Member # 622
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Thanks Zephyr for the link describing banana messengers. Too bad I didn't try to obtain a job with United Fruit way back when, I could have saved a fortune in Pullman fares.
whistler Member # 2620
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quote:Originally posted by HopefulRailUser: [QB] Paul - The "Acts" in 1949 over three days - Jascha Heifetz, Violin Soloist doing Mozart, Debussy and Tschaikowsky; the Bowl Orchestra led by Serge Koussevitzky doing Beethoven and Sibelius; and Artur Rubinstein, Piano Soloist doing Prokofieff, Rachmaninov and Tschaikowsky.
Thanks for appeasing my curiosity.
That must have been a set of concerts to attend.
PullmanCo Member # 1138
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Prior to the creation of the City of Los Angeles in 1936 or so, the Los Angeles Limited was the flagship train of the UP Overland Route, LA-Chicago. She was taken off sometime in the 1950s.
Whether we talk of Public Timetables or advertising, the railroads marketed their trains ... all of them. Public TT noted lounges, what types of Pullman space, what types of food service cars were used along the way.
The ATSF peer train to the Los Angeles Limited would have been, at that point, the Grand Canyon. The California Limited SFAIK was long gone even early post-war.
ehbowen Member # 4317
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Actually, the California Limited hung on through at least the end of 1952. (I'm working on the December 1952 timetable.) While I don't know if the two events were officially linked, it appears that the California Limited was discontinued at about the same time as the San Francisco Chief was introduced.
HopefulRailUser Member # 4513
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Just watched part of a movie on IFC. At the end the protagonist leaves town, Hartford, Conn., to go to Baltimore on the "New Haven". It was 1957. A very brown train.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Miss Vickie, The predecessor road serving Hartford was the New York, New Haven, & Hartford RR, or the New Haven. It merged into the Penn Central January 1, 1969.
Here is a site at which you'll find more than you'll ever want to know about the New Haven.
Having grown up along the New Haven (Riverside CT MP 31.5), I am often at a loss to know how an institution so reviled in life could be so revered in death.
HopefulRailUser Member # 4513
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You are right, more than anyone would ever want to know about the NH. But I did send them an email with info about the movie, it was not listed in their NH in the Movies feature.
You are indeed a never ending source of railroad info Gil.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Miss Vickie--
What is the title of the flick in question? Possibly IMDB has a page for it.
Be assured Mr. Dunn with NHRHTA will add it to their data base. From reviewing their material, for a 2000 route mile road, the New Haven most likely appeared in more flicks per mile than any other.
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The movie was "Far from Heaven", 2002 and here is what Mr. Dunn responded - nice guy.
I know the movie. It seems a good number of folks were watching IFC. I've gotten a number of emails today. FYI: The train scenes at track level were filmed in New Jersey and the station exteriors in Yonkers at the NYC station.
train lady Member # 3920
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As i was going through a file drawer I found a time table from 1972. In the back is a list of sample fares... N.Y. to LA in a roomette was $227.91 one way plus a small additional charge if you went coach on The El Capitan or Super Chief . You could go the Amtrak/Southern route. That was NY to DC by Amtrak and DC to NO by Southern and then NO to La by Amtrak. At the bottom it said"Overnight stay in exotic NO with the sleeping car as your hotel" There are pictures of the various rooms, the "new Amtrak uniforms" and instructions for bringing your pet along if you have a sleeper. The whole thing is fascinating. The National limited and the SantaFe were still running.
RRRICH Member # 1418
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Yes, that is right -- back in the early 70's, there was a through sleeper from the Crescent (still called the "Southern Crescent" then) which laid overnight in New Orleans, then was attached to the Sunset Ltd to L.A. I remember one year where I reserved that through sleeper and stayed in it overnight in NO.
rresor Member # 128
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Actually, Amtrak operated TWO through sleepers in those days. The one on the "Southern Crescent" ran through to Los Angeles on the Sunset, and the "National Ltd" carried a through sleeper from New York for LA via Kansas City.
All that was ended when the Western trains went Superliner in the early 1980s.
In retrospect, we (railfans) didn't realize what a good thing we had during Amtrak's "Rainbow Era". The PRR twin-unit diners came out of storage, ex-B&O obs-lounge sleepers ran on the rear of the Broadway, domes ran to Newport News and Norfolk, the variety of sleeper space was amazing...all gone now. Just watched the "Silver Star" come north past L'Enfant Plaza in Washington. Baggage, two sleepers, diner, lounge, four AM II coaches. What a disgrace.
RRRICH Member # 1418
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Yes, I also remember the thru sleeper on the National Ltd/Southwest Chief (which had some other name then, like Southwest Ltd or something), and also the twin-unit diners on the old Broadway Ltd. Seems also that, back in those days, AMTRAK's Florida trains had separate diners for coach and first class -- the coach class diner was a "lunch buffet" car, and the first class diner was a standard diner.
Gilbert B Norman Member # 1541
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Mr. Resor only 'scratches the surface' with his report of early-Amtrak larges. In the Midwest Chi-St Louis trains had Parlor obs (ex-GN), Dome, and full-Diners. Chi-Milw trains had ex-GN Obs-Lngs open to all. The MSP-Duluth Arrowhead had a Dome-obs (ex-Q when I rode) and I would dare say circa 1977, when the Empire Builder had a WB schedule roundly emulating the Pioneer Limited (and the Western Star beyond), it was likely the "classiest' consist ever to offer overnight Chi to Mpls service.
And I too have only "scratched the surface".
train lady Member # 3920
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At one time the Capitol had a separate lounge for 1st class and a separate section in the diner. Oh yes, while waiting for diner to arrive we were served pate and wine.
train lady Member # 3920
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oops!!! that should be dinner to arrive . The diner was already there
HopefulRailUser Member # 4513
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I thought it was a little odd that the diner came separately but then I never took part in these early and very interesting train journeys. Thanks for all the fascinating stuff everyone.
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