The bus bridge for the Coast Starlight between Sacramento, California and Portland, Oregon has now been extended through at least April 20th. Those holding a train reservation will be called by Amtrak to advise of the change.
As I mentioned in some other threads about this thing, the dates that Amtrak has been coming up with (seemingly at random, IMO) have been way, way off the mark from the very beginning. I hope they don't create this mess and confusion ever again!!!! (Note: I'm not referring to Amtrak creating the mess of the landslide. I'm referring to the way that Amtrak has handled this whole scenario).
Posted by Railroad Bill (Member # 5097) on :
We continue to worry that our May 28th departure on the Coast Starlight from LAX to PDX is not going to happen. Wonder how long they will go before they move the date back further? We would like to make other arrangements on San Joaquins, rental car, etc but not sure what to do at this point. Also wonder what the refund policy will be and how soon they will arrange that as well. We have a June 2 departure out of Seattle planned on the Empire Builder. Mother Nature has sure found a way to mess up a summer vacation. As always, thanks for all the great advice on this site.
Posted by HopefulRailUser (Member # 4513) on :
I think I am cancelling my May 8th LA to SEA trip and plan to drive. I used AGR points so I presume if I return the tickets they will reinstate the points. What a shame, I don't see a chance to take this train in my near future if I don't go in May.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
Vicki---for what it's worth, the UP has told Amtrak that once the line is open again, they will need to run freights over the route for 2 full weeks before allowing any passenger trains to go through. So even with the extremely optimistic opening date of the railroad being at the end of April, we still need to add two weeks beyond that.
Also, the revised date that Amtrak is advising on the re-launch of the train is May 10th (assuming the line is even open). Bummer. Posted by RRRICH (Member # 1418) on :
As I stated before, we are planning a trip on the CS from LAX to SEA on July 7 -- hopefully the line will be open by then. If it is not, I believe Mrs. Railroad Rich & I will be flying from LAX to Seattle and spending an extra day in Seattle before visiting my wife's friends in Anacortes, WA on our vacation (or we will stay an extra day in L.A. with my wife's son and his family).
To answer Vicki's concern about refunds -- if the line is not open by the time of your trip, you will be refunded the fare by AMTRAK. In our case, we will be traveling on a North America Rail Pass. if the train is not running by July 7, I presume we will get our accomodation (bedroom) charge refunded, but will not get any part of our basic Railpass coach fare refunded.
Posted by graynt (Member # 17) on :
Is there a reason the Starlight can't at least run up to Klamath Falls or is the mudslide south of there? This is very irritating. Like RRRich, we have reservations in July as well, on the second from LAX to PDX. This train trip is an integrel part of our summer trip, and if it is still not running by July, we will be forced to fly to Portland. Taking a bus from Sacramento is out of the question.
April 21 seems to be the reinstatement date for the CS. I can see mid April coming and the date being pushed back to say, Mid May. This will be my lady friends first Amtrak trip, and I chose the CS because of the relaunching and the fact it will probably be the greatest of all the Amtrak trains. Problem is, as our July departure gets closer and Amtrak still hasn't given us a definate yes or no, the airfare will go higher, and even taking other long distance trains, which would require moving around car and hotel reservations would be much higher in price as the date draws near.
It sure would be nice to have a definate answer. We 're still hoping our July date is a go.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
I will take a guess that it will be running the full route by your trip in July. But this is just a guess on my part.
I really doubt that the Coast Starlight will be running all the way through to Seattle by April 21st though. (The line would have to be open to freight trains two weeks before that, or April 14th---and that is less than four weeks from now, so I doubt it. I could be wrong! I guess we'll see what happens.)
As to your question regarding the train running to KFS, and having a bus bridge to Eugene---THAT is the million dollar question that lots of people would like the answer to. I don't think we'll ever get an honest answer to that one. There is even an internal investigation going on at Amtrak right now regarding an alleged "fake" letter that was allegedly sent from Joe Deely (an Amtrak management person in Oakland). But that's a whole other story........
Posted by RRRICH (Member # 1418) on :
graynt -- the mudslide is along the horseshoe curves just east (railroad south) of Oakridge, OR (well north of Klamath Falls, and also north of Chemult, but south of Eugene). If I knew how to post a topo map or a Google Earth image onto this forum, I would do so for you.
Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
My heart is hopeful, yet my nose smells another Sunset East scenario. Mother nature is certainly a tramp.
Posted by George Harris (Member # 2077) on :
quote:Originally posted by RRRICH: graynt -- the mudslide is along the horseshoe curves just east (railroad south) of Oakridge, OR (well north of Klamath Falls, and also north of Chemult, but south of Eugene). If I knew how to post a topo map or a Google Earth image onto this forum, I would do so for you.
Here are the mileposts of major points, south to north, or as the Southern Pacific would say, west to east, San Francisco being the westernmost point on the planet and all lines going east from there.
..4.5 Emeryville .88.9 Sacramento 106.4 East Roseville (start Valley Subdivision) 142.0 Binney Jct. (cross ex Western Pacific) 321.4 Dunsmiur 428.7 Klamath Falls 536.8 Cascade Summit 550.5 West Frazier 551.2+/- to 551.4+/- upper slide area 555.6 Fields 556.5+/- first horseshoe curve 560.7 Wicopee 561.6+/- lower slide area ....(about 2000 feet sideways and 800 feet lower in elevation than upper slide area) 563.2+/- second horseshoe curve 564.7 Heather - east end - just across creek from slide area 580.5 Oakridge 647.6 Eugene 718.9 Salem 770.1 East Portland
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
quote:Originally posted by amtraxmaniac: My heart is hopeful, yet my nose smells another Sunset East scenario. Mother nature is certainly a tramp.
Patrick, by now you have surmised that I am hardly passionate about any train (I ride 'em, but not just to ride as I think many folk here do), although I do note that my Amtrak journeys can be described as "more positives than negatives".
With that having been said, I doubt that many analogies can be drawn between Starlight and Sunset East. Sunset East was given ample time to develop a passenger base - and Amtrak's best equipment to boot. Only one major traffic source (TLH) was served during "somnambulist hours'. That it never had a Daily frequency can only be attributed to funding and the capacity of the CSX lines to handle such.
Starlight, on the other hand, has clearly shown it can put faces in the windows and fannies in the seats. I do not think the temporary line closure @ MP 561, which bet your bottom dollar the UP wants restored ASAP, will impact the train's future.
However, all interested parties must be prepared to accept that there will be a reasonable "break in" of the new trackage with freights of varying tonnage as well as deadhead passenger moves. In short the rant of "they've killed the Starlight' could well be a "non-operative' for some two weeks after the line is restored and freights are operating.
Finally, as of a few moments ago, according to the website, if you care to travel April 21 from San Jose to Portland in a Roomette rather than a bus, you're good to go. Of course around here, we KNOW the website is "Aristotle", "Sarah the Soothsayer", Nostradamus, or whoever.
Posted by Geoff M (Member # 153) on :
This Map should point roughly to Wicopee (measure either direction from George's mileposts and you might get a rough idea of where the mudslides were).
I remember that piece of railway! But only because I remember seeing the same building about three times, and seeing a following train, and eventually working out that we'd climbed an elongated S-bend.
Geoff M.
Posted by RRRICH (Member # 1418) on :
Now I am confused -- I thought the mudslide was just east of Oakridge (between Oakridge and the single horseshoe curve area across Salmon Creek) -- Wicopee is several miles further "south" (along the CS route). I can't find the exact posting, but I believe Mr. Toy put up a map here in the original thread on this topic several weeks ago, which showed the area by Oakridge, and not by Wicopee.
(If I knew how to paste maps into these boxes, I'd show you)
Posted by Geoff M (Member # 153) on :
I can't find the map to which you're referring - I simply pinpointed George's information on a map - or at least a point between the "upper slide area" and "lower slide area" he refers to. I cannot vouch for the source's source though George is usually pretty accurate.
Geoff M.
Posted by George Harris (Member # 2077) on :
George -- when I click the link to your aerial photo, I get a "page not found" message on a U.S. Forest Service web site
Posted by George Harris (Member # 2077) on :
So did I when I just tried it. Try this: www.fs.fed.us/r6/willamette/newsandevents/news/2008newsarchives/080130landslide.html This is the discussion about the slide that has the picture at the bottom. When I clicked on the link to the picture to get it in a pdf that I could copy, it gave me the link I put in above. Don't know why it won't work.
Posted by Henry Kisor (Member # 4776) on :
Richard Phelps, Amtrak's VP/Transportation, today sent a letter to a California passenger rail organization saying UP is shooting for an April 21 or 22 startup of the line and Amtrak is looking at a May 10 re-launch of the train.
To get an idea of what is and has been going on in the slide area, see this: www.budandraven.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=slideshow.Slideshow&g2_itemId=2496 Apparently these are pictures taken by one of the guys working there. Time span of pictures, January 16 through March 12. When you see the conditions they have been working under, it is amazing that they are making any progress at all. Also quite obvious, after all the earthwork is done and stabilized, there will be a need to to a major ballast cleaning and quite a bit of other track maintenance.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
Thanks for the link to those pictures. Wow, that is amazing stuff. What a massive work project that is.
Posted by Mr. Toy (Member # 311) on :
Those were intereting photos. Thanks George.
Someone mentioned a link I posted elsewhere to a map. Perhaps it was an image on this page (which I think George found originally) http://www.uprr.com/customers/updates/2008/0201.shtml Posted by RRRICH (Member # 1418) on :
Mr. Toy -- yes that was the map you posted earlier. When I first saw it, I thought I recognized it as the "horseshoe curve" just east of Oakridge, across Salmon Creek. I guess I didn't notice the second horseshoe curve at the bottom -- if I would have paid more attention, I would have recognized the map as the right location. Also, the name "Frazier landslide" does in fact tell me where the slide was. I know Frazier is on the 10- or 12-mile "double horseshoe zigzag section" of the UP line which leads down the Cascade Mountains (going north -- up the mountain going south on the CS!). I know exactly where Frazier and Wicopee are.
Thanks all for the clarifications! Hopefully the line will be reopened by July 7, when we have a reservation for a bedroom on the CS from LAX to SEA!
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
FWIW, the rumor-mill is now talking about re-opening the line in August. It's just a rumor, so I have nothing solid on this at all.
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