Travelling from LA to Chicago on the Texas Eagle does one physically have to leave one train to catch another? Looking at the timetable I see it arrives at SA at 1025pm but doesn't leave until 7 am. Any clarification much appreciated. Thanks.
Posted by Mike Smith (Member # 447) on :
The Sunset drops off a coach and a sleeper at San Antonio. They are added to the Texas Eagle in the early morning. I have slept through most of that when I was in a sleeper. You do not have to leave the sleeper or coach while you wait for 7:00 am.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
Just to add my 2 cents worth.....When you get on-board your train in Los Angeles, you are actually on TWO trains (even though they are all connected together as one train). One train is the Sunset Limited, and the other train is the Texas Eagle. As long as you fall asleep in your own car/room, you won't wake up to find yourself heading to New Orleans in the morning. Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
Further clarification: you don't have to change trains AS LONG as the train arrives into San Antonio by 7:00am. Otherwise, you will get off at San Antonio, take a bus to Dallas AND THEN board the Texas Eagle.
Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
The padding time is 8.5 hrs between when the SL arrives in SAT and the time the Texas Eagle leaves. Most of the time, there's NO problem. In the day when the SL didn't leave LA until 10:30pm...the connection was QUITE OFTEN missed and they'd provide bus service between San Antonio and Dallas to catch up with the Texas Eagle.
Posted by SunsetLtd (Member # 3985) on :
Actually they take them off in El Paso and bus them to Ft. Worth to meet the Eagle. When they get to Ft. Worth if they're heading south they take the southbound Eagle, if continuing north they just board the Eagle. This was commonplace when the SL was late enough by ELP that they knew they would not make the connection to the Eagle.
Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
I guess it was the rarity then....when I took it about four years ago, we were bused at San Antonio and ended up in Dallas over an hour before the Eagle. We only missed the Eagle by 30 minutes though in San Antonio.
Posted by heatherite (Member # 6059) on :
Thanks for these. I guess I have a better than even chance of not having to bus it at some point. As a matter of interest how long do these bus trips take (traffic allowing) i.e SA to Dallas or El Paso to FW?
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
I'd guess the bus ride from El Paso would be 9-10 hours as we're talking about 600 miles distance. From SA to Dallas more like 4.5 hours.
I'd book the sleeper so you'll be better rested come what may......and it actually is easy to get a good night's sleep while your sleeper sits on the sidetrack in San Antonio.
Posted by smitty195 (Member # 5102) on :
I've never taken the Texas Eagle before. Question: When the cars are sitting overnight in San Antonio, how do they provide power to the cars? Do they plug them in to something trackside, or are the cars connected to HEP from an idling locomotive? Or are they on battery power with no a/c and just the emergency lights? The "white noise" sound of the a/c is what puts me to sleep. Thanks in advance.
Posted by City of Miami (Member # 2922) on :
I've never done it but I think the drive from SAS to DAL will be more like 5 hrs. AUS to SAS is about an hour and a half even though its 70 miles. It's minimum 3.5 hrs. AUS to DAL. The traffic on I35, basically the only route, is hell most of the time, particularly through Austin. They have just last week opened a mostly completed toll road bypass of the Austin area.
Posted by train lady (Member # 3920) on :
Smitty, I never thought to ask but we did have full everything...lights and AC.
Posted by SunsetLtd (Member # 3985) on :
There are generators they plug the cars into on the platform in San Antonio but thats a rare occasion now. Mainly after the Sunset rolls east the Eagle is normally in the station as well. All they do is connect them and you can acutally walk through the eagle before they clean it. I sat in the Lounge car in the eagle as they cleaned and serviced the train. But just recently they started putting the through Sleeper in the front behind the dorm and tacking the Coach on the end, since Sleeper passengers were complaining about having to walk through the Coaches.
Posted by Geoff M (Member # 153) on :
Why not avoid the possibility of a bustitution and have a couple of nights in San Antonio? I did and quite enjoyed it. Spiciest breakfasts I've ever had; the Riverwalk with its restaurants had a pleasant ambience; and apparently there was some battle there.
Mind you, there is the potential of arriving in the middle of the night...
Geoff M.
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
I have to agree with Geoff; in fact I might even agree with Mark Twain, who named San Antonio as one of the four cities most worth visiting in the USA (Twain I think said these were the ONLY cities; I'd disagree there). I simply loved my stopover there this January & wish I'd had longer to stay. April should still be fine weatherwise, getting a little warm, but by May it could be too hot for a Briton--well, I'm not sure . . .
If you do decide to stop over in San Antonio, you should get your sleeper from LA to SA on the Sunset Ltd part of the train, not the Texas Eagle part--it's usually a lot cheaper!
Just a quick question: How come you are taking the Sunset Ltd/TX Eagle from LA to Chi, rather than the SW Chief? The latter is a better train, more scenic, and 1 day shorter. Unless you do decide to go to San Antonio, I'd recommend the SW Chief. . . .
Posted by heatherite (Member # 6059) on :
Why the Eagle? Basically, because I want to stop off at St Louis en route to Chicago and it seemed the most direct way to do that. I may be wrong - after all I am several thousand miles away - so always ready to be corrected!! I wasn't sure if the Kansas City Mule would be reliable enough if I took the SW Chief.
Posted by RRRICH (Member # 1418) on :
Heatherite -- the SW Chief is usually at KC on time going eastbound, so your chances of catching one of 2 daily trains to STL is pretty good. If you did miss the first train (which is the Ann Rutledge, not the ST. LOUIS Mule), the Mule leaves later in the day and you could take that.
NOTE: St. Louis Mule runs from KC to St. Louis; the Kansas City Mule runs from St. Louis to KC.
Posted by City of Miami (Member # 2922) on :
What I don't understand about the TX Eagle San Antonio thing is why they put the OBS crew off in Austin on #21 and they reboard in Austin next morning for #22. This, of course, means there is no breakfast on #22 which arrives in Austin 9:30 am. I wonder why they do that.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Mr. City, that is a perfectly legitimate question. In addition to the obvious 3.5hrs pay to travel AUS-SAS in each direction, if the OBS crew is assigned only Chi-Austin rather than San Antonio, an additional entire crew would have to be assigned as there is insufficient time for rest between arrival of 21 and departure of #22. While OBS crews are not covered by Hours of Service, their Labor Agreement nevertheless calls for a minimum rest time (I think ten hours) lest they be paid for continuous time; i.e. the layover at San Antonio would be under pay.
Additionally, Amtrak would incur "double lodging" and would require their crews to be "held away from home" for almost 30 hours. Guarantee you, such an assignment would be the last place the experienced "heads" would be bidding. Service would be provided by young "new hires" that were forced assigned to the job.
It is simply $$$$$; passengers on #22 leaving San Antonio and desiring Breakfast? Sorry 'bout that.
Posted by heatherite (Member # 6059) on :
RRRICH - thanks for the info. I only put "Kansas City Mule" because that is how Amtrak call it on their schedule page.
Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
That sucks about no breakfast on #22 leaving San Antonio. Doesn't that go against everything Amtrak advertises regarding "dining service at appropriate hours". Doesn't the Texas Eagle now have the Diner-Lounge combo car?
Posted by sojourner (Member # 3134) on :
Oh, I see, Heatherite. Based on what you had said in your earlier posts, I thought this was your first trip to US and first US train trip and that you wanted to stop someplace in the West and see the western scenery. Stopping in St. Louis is very much a different kettle of fish! Anyway, I have never taken the Ann Rutledge or Kansas City Mule but have heard that those trains are slow and often late, so it may be you are better off with the Sunset Ltd/TX Eagle, I don't know. But there was a song You Went the Wrong Way to St. Louis, and I think either route may prove that song correct. If I were going to St Louis (I've never been there), I'd go to and from Chicago and take a train that originates in St Louis for the northbound trip (not the TX Eagle).
Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
LAX to STL I'd consider the Southwest Chief to Kansas City and plan to depart on the afternoon train to St. Louis.......
The Kansas City Union Station is worth an hour or so to see by itself and with the various museums there one could spend the entire layover at the train station or the expansive park outside.
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
quote:Originally posted by SunsetLtd: Actually they take them off in El Paso and bus them to Ft. Worth to meet the Eagle. When they get to Ft. Worth if they're heading south they take the southbound Eagle, if continuing north they just board the Eagle. This was commonplace when the SL was late enough by ELP that they knew they would not make the connection to the Eagle.
Oh, boy, oh boy...
9 hours on I-10 and 20 across Texas in the Hound.
I did that trip once as personal travel in my car.
No matter how you slice it, El Paso to Dallas by anything not rail or air is PUNISHMENT.
Posted by PullmanCo (Member # 1138) on :
The Mules...
I guess they're named for the University of Central Missouri's mascots: The Mules and Jennies.
Of course, only one is the Mule; the other is the Ann Rutledge.
The UP (once Missouri Pacific) mainline across Missouri is busy trackage. Lots of coal, intermodal, and autoracks. Living here locally, I take them if and only if reliability is not an issue! Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
Regarding the OBS crew gettin' off at Austin, is that the entire OBS crew (sleeper attendants, coach attendants, etc.), leaving only conductors on board between Austin and San Antonio, or is it just the LSA's in the diner and cafe car who get off at Austin?
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Likely only the F&B crew as distinct from the entire OBS. A Sleeping Car MUST have an attendant per the labor Agreement. I'm not certain what trains, if any, are required to have a Coach Attendant, but if someone fails to get off at their stop, or if someone is injured handling luggage they have no business handling, then the presence of an Attendant can make the day "less of a bad day" for Amtrak.
Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
Well now that's silly, because the F&B LSA's on other LDT's usually work up until midnight in the cafe lounge cars, and then re-open at 6am in the morning, giving them 6 hours of down time. #22 doesn't even depart San Antonio until 7:00am, so that would even give them one extra hour!
What's so special about the hours of service on the Texas Eagle? Scheduled time into San Antonio for #21 is 10:25pm. (So that even gives them MORE time than their LSA counterparts on the other LDT's.) And if the train is running late, which it usually is, close the cafe down at 11 or 12midnight (like the other LDT's) and the LSA start's their downtime there back in their room in the dorm car. Hey, their sleeper and coach attendants are still working (alledgedly), until the train arrives into San Antonio! If they can go the full route, why can't the LSA's...?
When the Stublight LA - SAC was running, it arrived in Sacramento at 12midnight, and turned and went back at 6:20am. The LSA's went the whole way with the train and were aboard the train when it departed in the morning. No gettin' off in San Jose and then not having any food service in the morning from Sacramento to San Jose. If they could do it, why not the Eagle employees? What is so special about the Eagle? This just seems to inconvenince MANY passengers between Austin and San Antonio just so TWO employees can "get off early"...
Posted by MDRR (Member # 2992) on :
The changes in the dining car crew turning in Aus rather than Sas were made approximately 2 years ago under the guise of saving money...ie reducing the F&B deficits to appease Congress.
Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
Oh I get it. If they're not serving people, they're saving money.... Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
quote:Originally posted by Hoop: Oh I get it. If they're not serving people, they're saving money....
Also saved Amtrak from having to pay an entire extra dining car crew plus lay them over an extra day in San Antonio.
The F&B crew can't originate (per their contract) a new trip less than 10 hours after arrival. Even an on-time 21 (and how often is 21 on-time into SAS?) wouldn't allow the crew sufficient down-time to make departure the next morning.
This change, If I remember correctly, came about during a period of particularly horrendous timekeeping and was in place some time before the most recent mandate to lower F&B costs.
Posted by MDRR (Member # 2992) on :
Nice try, but there is nothing in the OBS employee's contract regarding having 10 hours (or less) off duty during their layover.
Posted by Gilbert B Norman (Member # 1541) on :
Sorry, but I was "too much the cmp'ny man" when I left the MILW Dec 1981. I had an Amtrak On-Board Service Labor Agreement at that time, but turned it in, along with much other stuff, such as a May 1, 1971 Operating Agreement, that would be helpful in this "second railroad career' of mine around here.
"Squealer" (sorry, Chief Clerk) didn't even know I had most of it.
Otherwise, regarding the "veracity' we seem to have here at this topic, The Beatles (and Target Stores) have a good one:
You say yes, i say no. You say stop and i say go go go, oh no. You say goodbye and i say hello Hello hello Posted by notelvis (Member # 3071) on :
quote:Originally posted by MDRR: Nice try, but there is nothing in the OBS employee's contract regarding having 10 hours (or less) off duty during their layover.
Fair enough....but would you want to work that turn being up by 5:00am to get ready for 22's departure when 21 didn't get in until 1 or 2am?
I suppose it would be doable if the F&B crew just stayed the night in their dorm car rooms.
Once some summers ago I was working with a competitive drum corps that had a very inexperienced tour manager. The group was using charter buses (rather than operating their own) and was at the mercy of the charter bus drivers who kind of snowed the young guy by making up their hours of service rules as they went along.
Mr. Norman, you never fail to impress......from waybills to union contracts to wine lists to hotel advocate to Wagner to the Beatles. Hats off to you sir.
Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
quote:Originally posted by notelvis: Fair enough....but would you want to work that turn being up by 5:00am to get ready for 22's departure when 21 didn't get in until 1 or 2am?
I suppose it would be doable if the F&B crew just stayed the night in their dorm car rooms.
The F&B crew can close down the diner by 10pm and the cafe car by 11pm, regardless of what time the train arrives San Antonio. However, their counterparts working the sleepers and coaches are still up (alledgedly) assisting passengers until the train arrives San Antonio. If they can do it, I don't see why the F&B crew is being treated special here...
Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
I'm just putting the pieces together here, but is it possible that comparing the Eagle's predicament to that of the Starlight like comparing apples and oranges? I'd be willing to guess that the starlight's crew was on CONTINUOUS service from LA to SAC then back to LA. The hours required for a round trip equate to about what most OBS crews do during a single one way trip right? One question I have is whether the Lounge car attendant ALSO detrain in AUS? Does that mean there is NO FOOD SERVICE WHATSOEVER between SAT and AUS? Bummer. It's like taking an EXTRA long ride on a Metro.
Posted by John Hull (Member # 4465) on :
There is a breakfast box provided to all Sleeper passengers after leaving Austin. The sleeper coach attendant brings them to you. Not as good as a cooked breakfast, but reasonable. John
Posted by Hoop (Member # 4607) on :
It that really after leaving Austin (we have to wait until 9:30am to eat), or did you mean after leaving San Antonio?
Posted by amtraxmaniac (Member # 2251) on :
So If your traveling COACH between SAT and AUS-brown bag it. LOL
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