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Author
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Topic: Diesel to Electric
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dmwnc1959
Full Member Posts: 58
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 10:27 AM
  
This past weekend on my first trip to NYC from Charlotte, North Carolina the 'Carolinian' stopped in Washington D.C. to switch from a Diesel engine to an Electric engine. I was wondering why it had to switch engine types midway through? [This message has been edited by dmwnc1959 (edited 12-15-2003).] IP: Logged |
CG96
Full Member Posts: 238
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 12-15-2003 10:46 AM
Well, you're at the southern end of the NEC, so most if not all engines on that stretch of track would be pulled by eletric traction. IP: Logged |
dmwnc1959
Full Member Posts: 58
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 10:48 AM
P.S. I dont know a lot of train lingo so explain it to me like I'm a five year old...:-)[This message has been edited by dmwnc1959 (edited 12-15-2003).] IP: Logged |
espeefoamer
Full Member Posts: 202
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 12:12 PM
The line from Wash.to NYC is electrified.Only electric engines are allowed into NYC after a serious accident in the early 1900's caused because a train stalled inside the station tunnel and a following train couldn't see a signal through the smoke. They used to switch engines shortly after leaving NYC at a place called Manhattan Transfer,but in the 1930's,Pennsylvania Railroad electrified the line through to Washington. ------------------
Trust Jesus,Ride Amtrak. [This message has been edited by espeefoamer (edited 12-15-2003).] IP: Logged |
MPALMER
Full Member Posts: 735
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 12-15-2003 12:14 PM
The electric engines are capable of higher speeds, to help keep things moving on the NEC. The MARC and other commuter trains have some diesel engines, as do all the freights, but it has been a long time since I've seen a diesel-hauled Amtrak train on the NEC. Maybe someone who lives out that way has more info. IP: Logged |
dmwnc1959
Full Member Posts: 58
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 12:53 PM
Now I know! Thanks for the great words of wisdom. I'm assuming that NEC stands for Northeast Corridor. Are there other AMTRAK routes in the U.S. other than the NEC that use electic locomotives? [This message has been edited by dmwnc1959 (edited 12-15-2003).] IP: Logged |
espeefoamer
Full Member Posts: 202
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 12:59 PM
Amtrak runs a few electric trains between Philadelphia and Harrisburg,but most of them are diesel.There are no other electric routes.------------------
Trust Jesus,Ride Amtrak. IP: Logged |
TBlack
Full Member Posts: 66
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted 12-15-2003 01:31 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by espeefoamer:
[B]The line from Wash.to NYC is electrified.Actually, the line is electrified all the way to Boston. Prior to Acela days, they used to switch from Diesel/Electric to Electric in New Haven which took about 20-30 minutes. By electrifying the whole route, the switch was made unnecessary thereby saving 15-25 minutes on the trip. IP: Logged |
dmwnc1959
Full Member Posts: 58
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 01:34 PM
Does anyone know of a link where I can see what an 'electrified' AMTRAK engine looks like? Does it have those antennae sticking out of the top to connect to the electric wires? IP: Logged |
JONATHON
Full Member Posts: 365
Registered: Nov 2003
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posted 12-15-2003 05:45 PM
Thats not called an antenna its called a pontograph, or for short: panto, heres a picture:  
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JONATHON D. ORTIZ
[This message has been edited by JONATHON (edited 12-15-2003).] IP: Logged |
dmwnc1959
Full Member Posts: 58
Registered: Oct 2003
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posted 12-16-2003 04:55 AM
THANKS for the pics Jonathon. Do you or any other post memebers know where I can find pictures of all the other types of 'electrified' engines that AMTRAK runs on the NEC. I would love to see them!!! :-) [This message has been edited by dmwnc1959 (edited 12-16-2003).] IP: Logged |
geoffm
Full Member Posts: 572
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted 12-16-2003 09:50 AM
espeefoamer, I have seen a diesel Genesis in NY Penn station. I have it on video somewhere. Not sure why or if it was a one-off though.Geoff M. IP: Logged |
JFB
Full Member Posts: 40
Registered: May 2003
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posted 12-16-2003 10:41 AM
Those are dual-mode Gennies--capable of drawing power from their own prime movers (diesel mode), as regular Gennies do, and from over-running third-rail (electric mode). In Penn Station they're used for all Empire Corridor trains (NY - ALB - BUF), the Lakeshore Limited (NY - CHI), the Adirondack (NY - MTR), and the Maple Leaf (NY - TOR). They operate in electric mode only in the station itself, switching to diesel mode about a mile north. By the way, there is no law preventing diesels from running in the city proper (LIRR and Amtrak do so every day), only from running into Grand Central Terminal, Penn Station and their approaching tunnels. Emergencies and extenuating circumstances excepted. IP: Logged |
geoffm
Full Member Posts: 572
Registered: Sep 2000
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posted 12-16-2003 10:49 AM
Ah. It didn't have a pantograph so I assumed (wrongly) it was diesel. Oops. Thanks for the correction.Geoff M. IP: Logged |
JONATHON
Full Member Posts: 365
Registered: Nov 2003
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posted 12-16-2003 06:11 PM
dmwnc1959,
A good place to find Amtrak photos is google image search.
http://images.google.com/images?q=Amtrak&ie=ISO-8859-1&hl=en ------------------
JONATHON D. ORTIZ IP: Logged |
JonA
Full Member Posts: 53
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted 12-16-2003 08:16 PM
BTW they take to dual mode genies off at ALB and switch to diesel for trains continuing north or west. A conductor told me that they have a limited amount of the Genies that can run on the third rails so they keep them b/w NYP and ALB.IP: Logged |
JFB
Full Member Posts: 40
Registered: May 2003
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posted 12-17-2003 06:42 AM
No mea culpa necessary, Geoff. Dual-mode Gennies are an anomaly in the Amtrak system that people outside of New York have little reason to regard. Few people even know that Penn Station has third rail, since only the Long Island Railroad uses it.The funny thing about the DM Gennies is that, as mentioned before, there is only about one mile of track on the entire Amtrak system on which they can run in electric mode (not counting access to Sunnyside Yards in Queens). Though the Hudson Division, on which they travel north to Albany, is electrified 32 miles north to Croton Harmon, the power there is supplied via ex-New York Central under-running third rail, which the DM Gennies are unable to use. Only Metro North commuter trains into Grand Central Terminal draw from that. Conversely, Penn Station's third rail is over-running--initially installed by the Pennsylvania Railroad, and used ever since by the LIRR. Since Penn Station is the dual-mode Gennies' reason for being, one mile of over-running wins out over 32 of under-running. This is not the first time New York’s diversity of electric pickup has resulted in unique locomotives. The New Haven Railroad ran into both Penn Station and Grand Central for decades, and developed engines “armed to the teeth” in power sources. One such locomotive, the FL9 (considered the DM Gennie’s predecessor), is still in use by Metro North today--albeit only in non-electric branchline service. IP: Logged |
rresor
Full Member Posts: 133
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 12-18-2003 12:19 PM
A couple of additional comments on electric locos:1) Amtrak has two types of electric locos left in service: the HHP-8 and the AEM-7. The HHP-8 looks like a double-ended Acela Express power car, and entered service only in 2002. The boxy AEM-7 has been in service since 1980. The E60 locos have been scrapped. 2) MARC also operates AEM-7s and HHP-8s. SEPTA has AEM-7s. NJT has ALP44s and ALP46s (44s look a lot like AEM-7s, ALP46s like nothing else). Neither MNR nor LIRR has "straight electric" locos. MNR operates dual-mode P32DM units, as does Amtrak. LIRR has some DE30AC units, also dual-mode. 3) MNR operates electric multiple unit (EMU) cars equipped for both third rail and catenary. LIRR operates 3rd rail EMUs. NJT and SEPTA operate EMUs equipped to use catenary. MARC equipment is all locomotive-hauled. 4) Diesels do operate under the wire. NJT uses diesels under wire at a few places, Amtrak runs diesels to Harrisburg, and until recently two of the FLorida trains changed from electric to diesel traction in 30th Street, Philadelphia. MARC also runs diesels under the wire (not enough electrics to go around) although this will stop once all the HHP-8s are accepted. 5) Had a pair of head-end rides on Amtrak trains from NYP to Saratoga Springs and return last year. Engineman used the third rail only from the platforms out into the "air gap" west of Penn Station, and started the diesel there. On the return trip, shut the diesel down in the air gap. So we operated electrically for only a few hundred feet! IP: Logged |
The Chief
Full Member Posts: 103
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 12-26-2003 07:08 PM
To add to some of the noteworthy comments...in mid-December I rode the Silver Star from Miami to NYC.
At Philadelphia I was talking to the conductor when we were changing engines from diesel to electric. He said at NYPenn Station, the diesel exhaust fumes would ascend to the station area, so they used electric locos on trains into NYP.------------------
_________Thë Çhîeƒ
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mlrr
Junior Member Posts: 9
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted 01-02-2004 05:48 AM
On a number of "Silver Service" trains, an a electric is swapped for a diesel at 30th Street Station as it heads south towards Washington D.C. So you have a much better chance of seeing a passenger diesel hauling an Amtrak train on that portion of the NEC between Washington and Philadelphia.I've seen diesel hauled Amtrak trains approach 30th Street Station Philadelphia from the South and switch to electric locomotive power.
quote:
Originally posted by MPALMER:
The electric engines are capable of higher speeds, to help keep things moving on the NEC. The MARC and other commuter trains have some diesel engines, as do all the freights, but it has been a long time since I've seen a diesel-hauled Amtrak train on the NEC. Maybe someone who lives out that way has more info.
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http://www.marylindsayrr.vze.com IP: Logged |
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