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posted 03-28-2002 06:29 PM            

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For a long time I've wanted to photograph trains on the Santa Ana branch, specifically on Santa Ana and Olive Streets in Anaheim. Does anyone know what the operating practices of UP are on this branch? Do they even run during daylight hours?

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posted 03-29-2002 04:37 PM            

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Commonly used by "Costa Mesa Local" heading toward L.A. Times Plant there via Metrolink, etc. during morning hours, plus sometimes the Marlboro job goes out in the afternoon.
Anaheim Al should be able to provide current update.

[This message has been edited by SteveD (edited 05-16-2002).]

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posted 04-07-2002 03:49 PM            

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Isn't there a section of street running on Santa Ana St. in Anaheim? Is Olive St. also street running? I just love seeing a train coming down the middle of the street (i'm sure you do to), definetely get some pics of this.

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posted 04-07-2002 05:28 PM            

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I live about three miles from this location, and I have seen operations on this line numerous times. There are two to three trains per 24 hours: the Costa Mesa local, the Marlboro local, and the Anaheim hauler. There is indeed a stretch of street running (about 1.5 miles long) down Santa Ana St. and then the tracks make an abrupt right turn and also run down Olive St. Both locals typically run in daylight hours. The Costa Mesa local leaves between 7:30 and 8:30AM and the Marlboro leaves between 2:30 and 3:30PM. Both often come back over this line later in the day. The trains are typically short, about 10 to 15 cars, though I have seen trains as long as 52 cars(these really snarl traffic). Speeds are slow, 10mph, and driving along side the train is permitted. There are some interesting things to look out for on this line - several wooden crossbucks have "Southern Pacific" written vertically on the post and a few have the old "look out for the cars" slogan on them as well. Additionally, there is an opertational wig-wag signal at the intersection of Lemon & Santa Ana Sts., which is the last one on Orange County, I'm told. Power for the locals usually consists of GP15-1's and SW1500's, although GP38's occationally make a showing if the train is especially long. Another train in this area to watch for is the Anaheim hauler, which is the "road train" that delievers long cuts of cars for the local trains. However, this train often runs at night and does not run down Santa Ana St. The big power ties up at the wye at the the corner of Broadway and Manchester. Power for this train is often solid SP units, usually SD40M-2's, aka "SD45's". Occasionally, the locals will not go down the Santa Ana St. branch, but instead go down another branch towards Huntington Beach and service industries on this line, although I don't know how often. Hope that helps.

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posted 04-07-2002 07:02 PM            

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I forgot to mention that operation is weekdays only. No trains on the weekends or holidays.

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posted 04-10-2002 01:36 PM            

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Hey atsf3751, thank's very much for the information. I look forward to tracking down one of the locals on street trackage hopefully at Lemon St. I can't recall any other locations in OC where wig wags still exist.

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posted 04-11-2002 12:49 PM            

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BSME25,
Check out this site for locations & photos of wigwags. Looks like you are right, only one left in Orange County.
http://www.trainweb.org/dansrailpix/WIG_WAG_state_list.htm

MP

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posted 04-11-2002 07:29 PM            

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For the past few days there has been heavy trackwork on the branch along the 5 freeway. It looks like they are doing a tie replacement project, so this probably means the locals have been running at their appointed times. Also, I saw electric generator components on several depressed-well flats in the yard today.

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posted 04-11-2002 07:31 PM            

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Oops! That is HAVE NOT been running at their appointed times (Marlboro local went out at 7PM today).

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posted 04-11-2002 11:33 PM            

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Hey MPalmer, great website on wigwags. I didn't realize their ranks were thinning so rapidly.

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posted 04-12-2002 11:38 PM            

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I looked at the wig-wag site and saw the photo of the old P.E. crossbuck that said "stop, look, listen." On Santa Ana St., there are a couple of old crossbucks that still read "look out for the cars" on the post. During what time period was this slogan used? Does anyone know WHY it was used? It seems rather odd to me. I should think it would be better to say "look out for the train."

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posted 04-14-2002 09:16 PM            

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I saw the crossbuck that had "watch out for the cars" at the intersection of Santa Ana and Olive. The street trackage was pulled out there but the crossbuck is still present. I have seen steam era photos where that warning was used so it must have been in the 30's or 40's. That's just a guess but I sure would also be interested why the warning is "watch out for the cars" instead of "train". Might this have been a Pacific Electic warning as in watch out for the street cars? Also, today I drove past the wye in Anaheim where the power for the Costa Mesa Local and Ana Hauler are tied up and I saw an SP switcher with all its oscilating lights intact. Didn't know any still existed. Hope to catch that one on the road!

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posted 04-14-2002 09:20 PM            

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Whoops, I mean "look" out for the cars.

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posted 04-14-2002 10:29 PM            

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What was its number??? Usually the power for the trains on this branch is captive to it for several weeks to several months, so it will probably be around for a while.

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posted 04-15-2002 08:21 AM            

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I don't remember the number but I am going to try to catch it on the road today. If I see it again, I'll get the number.

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posted 04-15-2002 12:10 PM            

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The engine number is 2756. It has "Kansas City" stenceled below the number. The front is painted out in a very light grey, I'd assume to cover graffiti. The red center lights have the lens missing as well as the rear gyralites. When I saw the power at the wye Sunday, there were 4 sets. The hauler power, two sets of two unit local power and the lone 2756. When I went there at around 9:00 this morning there was a new set of hauler power and one 2 unit set of local power was gone. I stayed till around 11:15 hoping the 2756 would go on the road but unfortunately it was in vain. I'm hoping that unit will stick around for awhile. Sure would like to video it in action.

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posted 04-15-2002 07:48 PM            

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Ok, I know which one you're talking about now. I've seen it, but never up close. "Kansas City" means that it came from the KC yard. It's a MP15AC.

As for not being able to see the train this morining, keep trying. The schedule they run on is quite loose, and the returning train is at the mercy of Metrolink because they have to run via trackage rights on the San Diego line after Santa Ana St. Catching the outbound train is a better bet.

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posted 04-16-2002 11:30 AM            

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Well I tried to catch it again this morning. It just sat there...I don't know if they even used it yesterday. Is this third set of power assigned to a local or is it perhaps just backup power. Also, does anyone know what radio frequency is used on these branches?

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posted 04-17-2002 12:08 AM            

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I have always found the afternoon train (the Marlboro local) to be a better bet. Usually, there are two sets of local power regularly on the branch. If one is gone, then the local is probably already out. It's hard to say exactly when it will come back because that all depends on how much switching they have to do and whether or not Metrolink will let them onto BNSF when they want. Also, it's possible the train went down the Huntington Beach branch, and since I've never actually followed it when it goes this direction, I don't really know where or when they go.

They have been doing a lot of trackwork on this line in recent days, so the locals have been running at odd times. However, as a general rule, the moring train goes out between 7:30 and 8:30 and the afternoon train between 2:30 and 3:30.

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posted 04-17-2002 11:19 PM            

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I believe the SP/UP locals use the radio frequency 160.77 for switching and talking amongst themselves. Communication with the dispatcher for the entire branch is 160.32 but isn't really used much that far down the branch. A good bet for tracking them is listening to the Metrolink dispatcher at 160.56. They will call pretty soon after leaving the Anaheim yard to let Metrolink know they are coming and with how many cars. Then call again when they are ready to come back.

I went by there also on Sunday afternoon to get photos of the "KC" switcher and saw someone in a white truck who had also just photographed it.

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posted 04-18-2002 11:24 PM            

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Hey Paul, nice to see you posting here too!

I saw the Marlboro again (from the freeway) today with TWO genuine SP units. One was the "KC" MP15 and the other was an SW1500. This was around 2:30 in the afternoon. I came back several hours later and saw the power had returned and was doing more switching.

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posted 04-19-2002 06:29 PM            

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I must be just missing these locals. I've been trying to chase them down almost every day. The power always just seems to be tied up at W Ana everytime I drive by. When I drove past the wigwag at Lemon St today, there were three UP MOW trucks. The crews appeared to be surveying the wigwag. Anyone know if UP is in the process of replacing it?

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posted 04-19-2002 09:08 PM            

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I don't take MOW trucks around the Wig-Wag as a good sign.

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posted 04-20-2002 09:50 PM            

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Yeah, that doesn't sound so good. They've been doing a lot of upgrades on the line recently -- they installed a crossing with lights and bells at Olive and South streets and they have been replacing a lot of track and ties. The wig-wag is not in great shape, and I always worry that one day I'll drive by and it won't be there.

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posted 04-20-2002 09:53 PM            

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I might add that the only reason that wig-wag has survived is because there is so little traffic on Lemon St. that is doesn't need much protection. If they take it down, I doubt they put up anything more than crossbucks.

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posted 04-28-2002 12:29 PM            

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I'm enjoying this dialogue, but just a reminder so you guys don't get too sloppy,
any crossbuck in Anaheim is genuine S.P. or ATSFas P.E. never ran there (as suggested by "3751" this is not a flame, just historical passion)

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posted 04-28-2002 11:25 PM            

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I was pretty sure P.E. didn't run on that line (I just used P.E. as an example of a railroad that put slogans on the crossbucks). What I still want to know is why SP (and other railroads) used "look out for the cars." It just seems a little unusual.

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posted 04-30-2002 09:16 AM            

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OCRHS May newsletter has nice account of this street route. Nonmembers may want to track down someone who is and take a look
(group meets first Monday eves of every month at SARTC, where new memberships are happily accepted!)

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posted 04-30-2002 01:27 PM            

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What is their contact information (i.e. website and/or mailing address)?

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posted 04-30-2002 09:11 PM            

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Orange County Railway Historical Society has no website, but mailing address is P.O. Box 3286, Orange, CA 92857-0286

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posted 05-07-2002 11:17 PM            

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I got pictures of the afternoon local on Santa Ana St. at the wig-wag and on Olive St. today. The train had two SP painted SW1500's for power and left the Anaheim yard around 3:30 this afternoon.

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posted 05-10-2002 11:16 PM            

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I finally got to video one of the locals on Santa Ana St the other day. It was a returning local at 5:40 in the afternoon. The sun was perfect and the train was 25 cars long. It was a sight to see. Right after I was done videoing the train, one of the residents from the house I was in front of asked me if I was photographing the last train through here. He went on to say that the maintenance crews that have been working on this street lately they told him that as soon as some bridge down the line was completed, they would no longer be using this section of the branch. Is there any validity to this rumor? I know of no other way that the UP could still get to all the industies they serve beyond Anaheim without utilizing this segment of the branch.

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posted 05-11-2002 05:32 PM            

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I think the resident may have heard wrong (at least I hope so). That branch has a very healthy supply of traffic (including several industries just past the street segment) and I also don't know of any other way that UP could get to them (unless of course they turn the branch job over to BNSF which they would surely NOT do).

They have been doing a lot of work on this line, mostly track and tie replacement, so it would not surprise me if they closed it down for a while for maintenance. They have put some concrete pads down in a couple of places on Santa Ana and Olive Sts., which tells me they will probably keep using the line. Also, they have been doing a lot of track and tie replacement through Anaheim and Buena Park.

However, there is another branch that goes to Seal Beach, in the opposite direction from Santa Ana St. Perhaps they have some kind of connection to the Costa Mesa branch from here. I have never actually seen much of this line, as traffic is not as frequent.

Anyone else know what UP plans to do with Santa Ana St?

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posted 05-16-2002 04:33 PM            

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Rest assured there is no alternate rail connection between Seal Beach area and Costa Mesa. P.E. once connected S.A.-H.B which never lasted into modern times, and S.P. once had a direct diagonal line between [West] Anaheim and Santa Ana, but that r-o-w is now I-5. This in response to 3751's speculation.

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posted 06-03-2002 11:54 PM            

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You guys are great, now I have a chance of getting *that* piccie of a train moving on Santa Ana or Olive and getting a pic of the wigwag working. I never knew that signal was there, I've alwasy went up Santa Ana, away from the 5 and never saw it, it's kinda hiding if you're facing that way. I took a pic of it no matter. I hope they don't take it down, it's historical.
I was up & down there today but no luck. Two of the SW1500's were working by Anaheim Union's bus yard..I was hoping they'd drag the boxes & oil cans thru Santa Ana.
No luck there.

Do you all remember the bridge that is now the 5/22 interchange, it went over the riverbed with the golf course in it. I barely remember it, my hubby just mentioned it and sparked that memory. I thought it was further north then thought, no, it was right there! Sucks, I liked that bridge.
I see there is a bridge way further down the riverbed which I would guess was a PE railroad. Have you all seen(im sure you have) the cool landmark for the garden grove line on trask?

GG

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posted 06-07-2002 10:11 PM            

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I think if you had waited longer, you would have seen those SW1500's on Santa Ana St. They normally switch the yard before going out on the road, and sometimes it takes a looooong time. But, if you are patient, they will get going some time, and waiting to see it run down the street is well worth it. Once again, the locals usually leave the yard around 8 or 8:30AM and 3 or 3:30PM, give or take half an hour.

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posted 06-07-2002 10:39 PM            

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This is just a side note to Buslady: Interesting combined hobby you've got there of railfanning and school buses. I remember as a kid, riding the bus home from school, and it was a Crown, #25 to be exact (didn't have tandem wheels like yours, though). Back then, every bus was a Crown (about 12 years ago). Those buses had a very distinctive (loud) sound. Crown doesn't make buses anymore, do they? Every Crown bus that I know of is pretty old. I assume your interested in fire engines because Crown made those too.

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posted 06-13-2002 10:05 PM            

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I've actually been able to catch both locals on Santa Ana St lately. Due to track maintenance, I've been able to listen to the interactions between the MOW crews and the locals on channel 44. It sounds like the MOW crews have been creating havoc amoung the local jobs. Just today, a crew on the local had heated words with the MOW crew. Apparently, the ex SP crew on the local didn't agree with the UP MOW crews east-west designation on the branch which resulted in the MOW crew not being able to service a segment of track that they scheduled to maintain. Looks like there are still ex SP crews not yet willing to conform to the mighty UP.

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posted 07-03-2002 10:53 PM            

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The SP 2756 with all it's oscilating lights intact is back. I've been able to catch it on the road several times now however never with the lights actually working. I wonder if they are inoperative. At South St and Olive St, the new cantilever signal was taken down a few weeks ago. It has been replaced by another cantilever signal bridge. I'm not sure why they would take down a new signal that was never even placed in service and replace it with another. It looks like the west side of South St is also getting a crossing signal. Hope they leave the Lemon St. wig wag alone.

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posted 07-04-2002 03:04 AM            

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FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

We got that elusive Santa Ana St photo!!!7-3-02, I guess the Marlboro was heading back to dump off cars by the freeway....4:45pm we caught it, and my hubby recorded the wig-wag in action...that is SO cool. And it's even cooler driving next to a train....hehe...we recorded the action on video with a digital camera w/sound, if you guys wanna see it I'll email it! Drop me a line. It's cool. You even see me running up to the train to get pics heheheeheh

I hope the wigwag is never replaced, but ya know, it's gonna happen someday. I want it!!

By the way, yeah I drive Crown buses and others at Certified Transportation. If you ever see a bus going up or down Santa Ana good chance its me trying to catch the train. I drove our '98 MCI up & down there to kill time returning from a trip. You may catch a black Saturn VUE going around there in circles trying to catch a train, that's me.
Crown #25 at Saddleback was my bus, that's funny same numbers.

[This message has been edited by Buslady (edited 07-05-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Buslady (edited 07-05-2002).]

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